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[TOWN WINS] Third Anniversary Fanfic Mafia - Game Thread

Dragonfree

Moderator
Staff
Location
Iceland
Pronouns
she/her/hers
Partners
  1. butterfree
  2. mightyena
  3. charizard
  4. scyther-mia
  5. vulpix
  6. slugma
  7. chinchou
May paced restlessly back and forth. They were running out of time.

[[All right, here's where we're at right now.

Very likely town
Muse (windskull) - Her claim checks out, seems very unlikely mafia, and would be risky to make. Hard to believe she isn't town.

Probably town
NeoLurosa (Jackie/Yellow) - Just receiving a message and being swapped doesn't make them town, but mafia could easily have chosen to keep the message quiet and probably gained from it, and I like their vibe - Jackie feels like town!Jackie, I think.
Nefari (DawningWinds) - I'm reluctant to dismiss the possibility a multiswapper is mafia, but so far this has really felt like DW's townplay to me and the casual claim opening themselves up to a counterclaim is evidence.

Soft town
Antares (AbraPunk) - Has mostly just not said very much but it feels in line with previous townplay, more or less.
Burhalla (IFBench) - His play reads super like his previous townplay to me, just lighter on the RP? I gueeess that could be because Burhalla would be a weird character to play as mafia and it's made awkward, but the quick little gambit and the kind of ill-advised pressure claim are just exactly how Bench has played in previous games as town. Maybe faked, I guess, but definitely not inclined to vote for him right now.
Archie (Starlight Aurate) - I think his explanations of the mailman debacle check out. Not inclined to vote for him right now.
Jet (Chibi Pika) - There's nothing solid here but I like their reasoning and reads and vote-prodding. Might reevaluate later but for now I think I trust them.

Null
Kichiro (Virgil134) - I'm not really a fan of the suspicion on him right now; feels like an easy target for not particularly solid reasons. Hasn't said a lot but he absolutely did make an effort to get at something with the whole parrot/absorber theory, etc.
Steven (Panoramic_Vacuum) - Don't really have much of a read on him at the moment. Nothing that strikes me as suspect.
Rascal (Flyg0n) - Not much to go on, just some confusion, but also has been sick.

Suspicions
Dorien (Sinderella) - As much as I appreciate her helpfully going and finding what I was thinking of in the last game for me, I can't help but suspect she did so in the hope of preempting me doing so myself and making herself look better for it? She seems pretty preoccupied with self-defense, and still get the same vibe as from her play last game.
Altair (Inkedust) - Still just the vibe, man, I don't really have an explanation, would have to do more reading. Maybe I will overnight.]]

"Yeah. Yeah, okay, something like that. Just... shut up." May turned toward the irritating man. "I still think it's you."

[[Vote: Dorien (@Sinderella)]]
 

Chibi Pika

Stay positive
Staff
Location
somewhere in spacetime
Pronouns
they/them
Partners
  1. pikachu-chibi
  2. lugia
  3. palkia
  4. lucario-shiny
  5. incineroar-starr
jet-bored1.png
"Anyway, I made my vote so the rest of you can figure out the rest. I'm gonna go nap."

[[I only have class 3 times a week and yet Mafia EoD is perfectly synced with it. :unquag:]]
 

Panoramic_Vacuum

Hoenn around
Partners
  1. aggron
  2. lairon
Steven had managed to shape the nothingness of the void into something that resembled a writing surface, and had been scratching notes into its surface for the better part of an hour. With a sigh, he finally paused and wiped his hands against his trousers.

"I believe the Floatzel was on to something. These messages, we certainly did talk a lot about them, and at quite some length. I've gone back through and collected our thoughts on the matter not to solve the mystery of the mailmen and who they are, but to see how we all have handled the discussion."

"The first day of discussions went as follows..."

The possibility of multiple mailfolk is interesting. What if one of them's on our side and one isn't?]]
[[The first first message about multiple mailmen after the reveal of two messages that night came from Sike (a now-confirmed TP and suspected mailperson themself). They also are the first person to suggest different alignments for these mailmen: one town, and one mafia.

"Don't see much use of there being one on the Mafia side though," he added, as if reading the nosspass' thoughts. "Aren't mailmen some form of communication for us innocents? The thing we don't have?" he asked.
[[Inke seems skeptical of Sike's suggestion, wondering why mafia would have a mailman and what utility it would bring to the scum team.]]

"Well yeah, but like. What if they can send messages to us? Messages that are total bs. They could screw with our heads," Karo suggested.
[[Sike suggests that the mafia would use their mailman to send false info to the town.]]

Neo blinked at the big spiky cat and sent a wave of telepathy his way. What if there was a bad guy mailman, and their goal was to mislead people?
[[NeoLurosa expresses concern about the potential for a misleading scum mailman, also arriving to a similar idea as Sike.]]

We could have one mailmon that delivers multiple messages, or two separate ones. One could be on our side, one could be on the other to throw us off.. Trick us. Or they could both be good. I can't see them both being bad. That would feel... weak."
"Like I said. There's a chance one of our carriers is looking to deceive us. Though... I wouldn't work under the assumption that one must be bad."
[[Wind offers the idea of one person sending both messages, or not. Also wonders about opposite factions, or if both mailmen (if there were two) were town. Doesn't think both would be scum. Agrees there's a chance of one scum, but not that there has to be a scum mailman.]]

[[Ooooooooooooooooo that's a very good observation; wouldn't be surprised if each side had one, but I also don't want to fully dig my heel into that idea just yet]]
[[Sind chimes in, agreeing with the previous posters of a possible good/bad mailman. Doesn't want to commit to the idea yet.]]

"I don't think it was a code, just a nonsense phrase. My theory from before stands: I think someone innocent was just sending a message to let us know that a mailman--or mailmen--exists."
[[Starlight (a now-claimed mailman) wonders if the message(s) were simply to alert the group to the existence of the role.]]

[[My thoughts are pretty much summed up by Sike/Windskull. Looks like we've got two potential mailmen (or just one who can send multiple messages?) and so far, that's all we've got to go off of. Both Free and I claim our messages were not useful and had no context.]]
[[Starlight then commits to the idea of two mailmen, offering that it's possible there is just one.]]

[[Don't have much to add. I agree with Sike, Windskull, and Starlight.]]
[[Bench chimes in to simply agree with everyone else.]]

“So, two messages received; two couriers. Or a single courier that can send two messages, perhaps. Did anybody else come to witness anything that they feel safe to share?"
[[Sind rehashes the idea of two vs one mailman. Wonders if it's safe to reveal/share more.]]

"I don't want to ask anyone to reveal too much, but would there be any way to see if the messages are similar, or related? Could it be code broken into several pieces? Or is one message a cipher for the other?" He frowned.
"Or could they be interpreted as a warning, a way to mark a target?"
[[I pose the idea of comparing the messages to see if they are related. Wonders about a coded message, or potentially a way to mark targets.]]

"I beg your pardon, but I'm not sure I'm ready to assuredly credit the idea that there are two 'mailman' players, just yet," she said, lightly. "With so many roles available, and given the nature of 'role madness', I would be a little surprised if there were duplicate roles in play, hm... It's possible, I grant, but there is another explanation for two messages – besides that one or both recipients might be untruthful! – namely, one message may have been sent by a Parrot. I note that this role is among the list of valid powers. I would caution against drawing firm conclusions with so little evidence available."
[[HelloJackie is skeptical of two mailmen, surprised if there were duplicate roles in play. First to suggest Parrot theory.]]

Now if only everyone could get mail. It sounded like said mail was basically just spam, but it could be good for a laugh, at least.
[[Sike jokes about getting mail, is the first one to offer the term of "spam" in relation to the nonsense messages, maybe as a joke.]]

[[PARROTS, I forgot about parrots. That's actually a really plausible explanation. Of course, now I wonder if the messages sent are duplicates or if the parrot gets to come up with their own message.]]
[[Sike then latches onto Parrot theory and wonders how that might work.]]

Her gaze turned next to May and Archie. "You could each day the first few letters of the message you received. If they're the same, then they likely either came from the same person, or a parrot. I'd they're different... Well, we don't learn too much, but it could be valuable information. However..."

She closed her eyes again and let out a sigh. "One of you could be lying about receiving a message, though I doubt it at this time. Or you could lie about the contents. Then there's the question of whether we want confirmation of a parrot at this point at all."
[[Wind offers a way to compare the messages to test Parrot theory. Then wonders if someone is lying about receiving a message, or its contents. Then wonders if we even should try to find out if there is a Parrot in play.]]

Neo cocked his head to the side as he listened to the Slice-Cat. Maybe someone could be lying, but why would they? Wouldn’t that be risky for a bad guy to try? And why wouldn’t everyone want to know if there was a parrot around?
[[HelloJackie is skeptical of someone lying, seems like a bad idea for a mafia member to try. The wonders why we wouldn't want to know if a Parrot was in play.]]

[[Maybe they can both reveal the first and last word? Or perhaps the longest word of their respective message? Idk I feel like it’d be so easy for one to copy another if one of them is indeed lying.

Lol, count total words of the messages? Or syllables? That could be at least a semi-decent clue if they got the same message or not.

Ofc I don’t want to feel like we’re beating a dead Mudsdale here, especially if it turns out the messages are in fact just useless, but I do think it is helpful to at least try to confirm the existence of some roles a la multiple mailmen, or a mailman and a parrot, etc. etc.]]
[[Sind suggests the same way to reveal the messages as Wind as well as several others. Wonders if the messages are useless, or are intended to confirm the existence of the mailmen role. Also this is the origin of the Mudsdale incident (lol)]]

"The problem with that theory is that a parrot uses a person's action on themselves. So if that was why both of us got a message, that'd mean one of us is the one who's sending messages in the first place. I know I'm not. I didn't think the pirate guy sounded like he was, either."
[[Free expresses doubt about how Parrot theory works from a gameplay standpoint. Claims they are not a mailman. Thinks Starlight probably isn't either.]]

"It would be risky," Muse admitted. "But it's not unheard of for a bad guy to lie about getting something, or lie about whet they received. I'll fully admit that doing so this early in the game would be dangerous, and it's for that reason that, while I wanted to address the possibility, it is rather unlikely that either of the strange simipour are lying.

"As for my concern with revealing the information right away... In the most basic scenario where there is no bus driver, that would mean one of our two recipients is the mailman, which in theory would narrow down who might have a more...lucrative role to target for the bad guys. I was going to suggest that if we went through with asking, neither claim that they are or aren't the mailman to make it harder to guess, but... I was a little late to do so. Apologies."
[[Wind reiterates that it's possible someone is lying about the message or its contents, but that it is risky and doesn't think anyone is lying. Goes on to theorize about revealing who is the mailman could provide targets for the mafia (or eliminate potential targets from the pool of more powerful roles. Suggests no one actually claims the role outright.]]

"Please, correct me if I'm wrong," Steven began, "My head still hurts quite a bit... But if I'm understanding the situation, is it also possible that neither message recipient is the Mailman, and we have two other people here who can send messages at night? Or one other person who can send multiple messages? And no Parrot at all?"
[[I wonder if neither recipient is a mailman at all, and am unsure if there are one or two alternate senders of said messages, and also suggest no Parrot.]]

[[Been brought up quite a bit while I was asleep, but I feel that we need to hear from both Free and Starlight. If it's a Parrot, that means one of them is our mailman but I don't want to subscribe to that theory just yet. More I think about it, more I believe that this mailman can send multiple messages as it has been known to be able to use their ability more than once per night. Though again, baseless speculation.]]
[[Inke leans more into the single mailman with multiple sending powers theory, but says it is pure speculation.]]

Anyway TLDR is that I’m not convinced there’s two mailmen and I think something else or another messaging-type role is in play, and if for some reason there are two mailmen then it’s almost certain that one of them are scum because two town mailmen makes zero sense to me.
—Yellow]]
[[HelloJackie is certain it is only one mailman and some other messaging role. Also is certain if there are two, they have to be opposing alignments. Does not know why there would be two town mailmen.]]

Yellow's post makes sense, I think? Having duplicate roles isn't out of the question, considering it wasn't specifically called out as a condition that wouldn't be in the game. (Heal clash was called out as not happening, but not that there couldn't be two Doctors, per se). It does feel weird though given the big list of roles we got...

With the Parrot theory, Free denied being a Mailman, but did she deny being a Parrot? Is having a Parrot hard claimed a good or a bad thing? How about a Mailman? I guess what I'm getting at is are we giving some nice, juicy targets for the scum to pick off by going down this road? Though I have no idea what other road we have to be going down.
[[I agree with Yellow's post, reiterating that two mailmen is possible on the grounds that duplicate roles are not explicitly called out as not existing in the game (per the rules post), but having duplicates does feel weird. Wonders if Free might be the Parrot, and if us figuring out who is what role is helpful to town or not.]]

“Maybe one mailman sent two letters or maybe there’s two mailmen and they also can do other cool stuff cuz they have custom powers,” Jet said, flicking her tails. “Even if the letters are different, we still wouldn’t know. All I know is the parrot’s gotta copy the same guy they visit. But I don’t think the blue-haired girl is a parrot anyway.”
Jet tilted her head at the Luxray’s Voice. “Even if those humans got the same letter, it’s not like there’s gotta be a parrot. Maybe some guy just sent two letters. Anyway why do we wanna figure out their power without them tellin us? That’s like us doing the bad guys’ job for them.”
[[Chibi rehashes where we've landed with mailman theory, but says they don't think Free is a Parrot. Also is worried about figuring out the roles as being helpful to mafia and hurtful to town.]]

I don't think its impossible for this mailman or whatnot to be able to possibly send two messages? Assuming everyone is telling the truth about getting a message, and Free isn't lying, which I doubt.

Alternately, Isn't it possible jack of all trades could have Mailman powers?
[[Tetra posts (hope you feel better!) Rehashes mailman theory but then suggests JOAT as a potential one-time mailman.]]

I think I’m ready to ditch the Parrot theory for now, at least to explain the two letters, because it just doesn’t work. It’s very possible we have a JOAT mailman—I forgot we might have a JOAT in the game and that seems reasonable.
[[HelloJackie wants to ditch Parrot theory. Likes the idea of JOAT being a potential explanation for the second message.]]

"Yeah. The parrot thing was just raised as an explanation for there being two messages when having two people with the same role seems weird." May frowned. "It is kind of weird, but I can think of ways that could be true. Maybe a couple different people have messaging as a side power, or something. Or it's just that one's town and the other's mafia."
[[Free also wants to dismiss Parrot theory. Says having duplicate roles is weird, but not unheard of. Also suggests the one town/one mafia theory of two mailmen again.]]

"The sense I'm getting is the messages were sent by two different people. If it was the same one, if they're going to write a random quote in one, wouldn't they probably do a quote in the other one too? Mine's not a quote. Actually I think mine might have been from the mafia mailman, because if you took it at face value you might think it's a gameplay effect, but I'm pretty sure it's not. Maybe it's just someone fooling around, but maybe they're trying to mislead people."
[[Free believes the messages did come from two different senders. Wonders if their message came from the mafia mailman because it's at least related to gameplay, but not actually gameplay.]]

[[This is pretty much what I though. It's good to hear your thoughts regarding the situation. And it's definitely something to be aware of. With the possiblity of a mafia mailman, I don't think we should take any claims of identity in the messages at face value without some form of proof.
[[Wind also subscribes to mafia mailman theory, worries about identity claims because of this.]]

[[I'm not sure if I can fully subscribe to the idea of a Mafia mailman because it feels...weak. If there is one with the intent to deceive/throw off Town, then I don't get why the message would contain nonsense (though we'd probably need a wider pool than just N0 to try to confirm this). As a whole I feel that this entire convo regarding mailmen has been on the more unproductive side seeing that it's mostly speculation at this point. The messages being different doesn't confirm that they weren't sent by the same person.

Parrot theory can probably be thrown out the window though. Not dismissing the possibility of there being one in the game entirely, but if there is, they didn't use their action on the mailman.
[[Inke uncertain about mafia mailman theory. Unsure why a misleading message would contain nonsense, and thinks the mailman talk has been unproductive. Different messages don't necessarily mean different senders. Also wants to ditch Parrot theory.]]

[[Aaaaalllllright so I'm set on scrapping the Parrot theory for now based on this; down to single Mailman with double send or two separate Mailmen. I can't really side with either because on one hand, I see a world where one Mailman decides to send messages with wildly different contents (for some reason ig maybe just tryna flaunt their existence in some way), but I could also see two different Mailmen being on two different wavelengths and sending completely different things, especially if they're on opposing teams. I don't know. It's a little hard to really say without knowing the full context of the messages (but for the love of god maybe don't reveal them yet I'm just saying kekw).
[[Sind chimes in that she also wants to ditch Parrot theory. Reiterates the one vs two mailman theory, unsure of which one because different message contents =/= different senders, or different alignments of the senders. Doesn't commit to anything without knowing the full context of the messages, but asks them not to reveal.]]

[[Don't have much to say, other than that the parrot theory does sound very complex, and not probable. I think it's more likely we either have two postmen, a postman who can naturally act twice, or someone used a power on the postman that lets them act twice.]]
[[Bench chimes in to say they don't have much to say, and again reiterates Parrot theory is confusing and the one vs two mailman theory. Then suggests possible motivation as a reason a single mailman could act twice.]]

"Couldn't agree more," he said to Karo. "I don't know which is more ridiculous, the fact that this keeps happening, or that apparently everyone here is a pirate."
[[Just putting this here as this is the conversation I had with Sike (all RP) about having all the pirates in this game, and seems to be the context of the message I received last night.]]

[I guess the message senders probably wouldn't have a goal right now, would they? Other than to let everyone know that they exist? I can see how message sending would definitely be useful, but on N0 nobody knows anything about anyone yet.]]
[[Starlight again wonders about the motives of sending the message, and if it was simply to alert the group to the mailman's presence.]]

[[Oh, I didn't think of a strengthener! I do think that last one is least probable, just because I don't think anyone would hasten another player on N0 without know anything about each other.]]
[[Is interested by Bench's suggestion of a motivator (Starlight is later corrected by Inke that it's not a strengthener but a motivator that would accomplish this).]]

I don't have any thoughts on the whole message thing given that it doesn't tell us a whole lot at this point in time, so I don't know what else we can do. ]]
[[Virgil chimes in saying he doesn't have any thoughts and is unsure of what to do with the whole mailman thing.]]

[[I have precious little to contribute at the moment. bad week.

@Dragonfree I believe you said you wouldn't reveal the actual contents of the note yet, right? In which case I doesn't much matter what was said I guess, at least right now.

The whole mailman thing seems like a moot point.
[[Tetra also seems interested in dismissing the mailman discussion.]]

I don't have many thoughts on the mailman situation that haven't otherwise been stated; double mailmen seems more likely to me than single mailmen by a hair though.
[[DawningWinds posts and says they have no additional thoughts either. Says double mailman is maybe more likely than single.]]

Okay, so. Day ending soon. All we know is that two messages happened for some reason. My theories at this point re: that are that either we have two mailpeople or else maybe one mailperson and a jack of all trades who sent a message last night, too. (Although, why use up your message shot so early, when you know nothing other than what you are?) At any rate, it tells me precisely fuck all about who's scum and who ain't.
[[Sike reiterates the two vs one mailperson and a JOAT, but wonders why a JOAT would use their one-shot mail power on N0.]]

[[ I do worry someone could lie about the mailman thing, except that should be a bad idea right? Except it seems like someone could just.... pretend to have received a message but want to keep is secret for now?
[[Tetra worried about lying, though says it seems like a bad idea.]]

[[Probably not? It wouldn't seem smart, you'd expect the same amount of messages to presumably be sent the next night so you'd expect someone else to be able to confirm the messages later. Though it might be a tad safer in a game where roles don't flip so someone could just try to argue that the mailman probably died.]]
[[DW agrees it's probably not smart to lie, and it would be corroborated by number of messages on the next night, unless a mailman is eliminated.]]

[[Unless scum somehow knew they killed a mailman and are pretending its still around to coast by as town.
[[Tetra theorizes that scum could know they killed a mailman and would roleclaim for credibility.]]

[[Receiving a message isn't town indicative though?
And I don't think that makes sense. Trying to argue the Namo was a mailman makes sense to cover such a lie, but it would only work if Namo wasn't actually a mailman because kills usually go last, so the number of messages received would go down by two instead of one.]]
[[DW uncertain of Tetra's theory, also says receiving a message isn't indicative of town.]]

"Anyway," May said, "I've been thinking and I think I should tell you why I'm leery of my message at least before the day ends. The message said, 'Congratulations! You have received an [item]!' Only unless I'm blind I'm not seeing, you know, the actual item. It's just a message. That's why I felt like it might be trying to mislead. Or it might not."

[[Please disregard the bit where apparently I missed that there was an "an" there when I described the contents of the message. ~_~

Anyway. I am pretty sure that if there is an actual item mechanic it would come in the form of bold text in the actual mod message, and not just being told you received a message that says you got an item. In case I die tonight, I want to preempt the possibility that others receive messages like this and take it at face value and start talking about an item mechanic that probably doesn't actually exist. If it is trying to mislead about an item mechanic, that absolutely sounds like a thing a mafia mailman might do. On the other hand, maybe it's just somebody trying to be cute, who didn't realize it could be interpreted as a mechanical thing.]]
[[Free reveals the contents of her message, warns that it could be scum misleading, and the item mechanic doesn't seem like a real mechanic, so don't waste time debating it.]]

[[(There's also the possibility that the mailmen are not allowed to actually pick their message and instead it's restricted, e.g. a mailman who can only send messages about giving items and all they can choose is which item, or a mailman who can only send messages that appear on an IMDb quotes page, or whatever.)]]
[[Free suggests maybe the mailman messages are pre-selected. (this seems to have been debunked in the message from D2 stating a character limit on the message, also the fact that the messages were different from D1s messages)]]

I'm trying to find a way that bringing up the question of night messages would benefit scum when the only other message we know about (that Starlight received) is just a quote from a TV show? That wouldn't feed false info, and using an open question during the day to ID a message recipient of a scum mailman would be weird because scum should already know who is and isn't on their side.
[[I wonder how nonsense messages would benefit the scum team, since scum should already know their targets, they wouldn't need a message to ID recipients.]]

The only reason I could see sussing Free is that by bringing up the messages, the intention was purely to waste our time (which it kind of did, but at the same time now we know there is a mailman in the game, perhaps two, and that's more info than we had prior).
[[I throw potential sus at Free for using the mailman discussion as a time waster, though wonder if it was a waste in the first place since we know the mailman exists now.]]

[[I thought about this too, like in Humble Vale when there were only a few phrases each messaging role could send. I'm trying to wrap my head around the utility of the role if it were restricted like this. If the messages are nonsense, at best it could act like a bus driver check, and at worst they simply alert the game to their presence. I guess the worst might be if it were a scum role, it's meant to waste time?]]
[[I agree with Free about the potential of pre-selected messages, and maybe the mailman can use their messages as a way to check for swaps. Wonder if the utility for a scum mailman is simply for time-wasting.]]

[[lol beat me to it. There are two custom roles in this game per the sign up post, maybe one of those is related to this? Or is some kind of modified fruit vendor? The kind of janky nonsense of both messages makes it feel like a spam email or something. Would a spam mailman role exist to throw off the usefulness of a real mailman?]]
[[I point out that the second message sender could be a custom role and not a mailman. The idea of spam mail comes up again here as a way to make a town mailman less useful. Fruit vendor is also brought up, but Free points out it is not on the list of roles in the game.]]

What's mailmans usual utility? I guess its a decent way to communicate between known town members. But if its restricted then what good would it be? Maybe this message was just sent to test... ]]
[[Tetra wonders about mailman's utility for town.]]

[[I think at this point, it’s best to just let the mailman thing rest since we aren’t getting anywhere with it for now. The fact that both of these messages sound nonsensical makes me think that they were both some sort of test? But of course we can’t be too careful, it’s possible the item or the quote means something…I dunno. There doesn’t appear to be any clear code, as far as I can tell.
[[HelloJackie wants to drop the mailman topic. Worried the item quote does mean something, but no way to know for sure. Definitely not coded messages.]]

Starlight Aurate (Archie): I feel like you've been a little less forthcoming about the nature of your message than Dragonfree (May). This, combined with the fact that you weren't the first to claim receiving a message, has kind of left me wondering if there really was a second message.
[[Sike thows some sus at Starlight for potentially hiding their message contents and claiming second. Wonders if there even was a second message. This is debunked by the presence of multiple messages on D2.]]

[[Yeah, as I was saying, my working assumption is there is not actually an item. The mod message told me I got a message and then quoted the message, which was that. I doubt that's how it would be presented if there are genuine items in the game. That's why I think the message may be intentionally misleading.

I am a little miffed that nobody at all has engaged with my reasoning about this? I do really hope it doesn't get overlooked, I will be yelling in deadchat if I die and then people start talking about items/assuming the person sending items is town.
[[Free reiterates that she is suspect of the item mechanic mentioned in her message and to not get sucked in to talking about it, and that it seems deliberately misleading.]]

[[I agree. Receiving an item would be expected to be announced clearly and differently than a message. I didn't engage with it previously because there didn't seem to be a point in making a post just saying this but since you're worried about it being overlooked I figured I might toss in my entirely nonunique two cents.]]
[[DW chimes in on why they didn't address the item mechanic that Free was concerned about.]]

Aaaaaand that covers D1. I don't think I'm going to have time to go over the D2 discussion about messages, but we now know that Sike flipped TP, Starlight claimed mailman, and we had three messages today, two of which were swapped via DW's bus driver one-shot power.

Hopefully this is enlightening on who was engaged with what in the discussions, who was theory crafting, and who was repeating info we already knew. And now I need to read any new things that popped up in the thread while I was putting this together.]]
 

NeoLurosa

Junior Trainer
Pronouns
J:they/them HY:she
Lurosa sighed, gem glinting repeatedly as she skimmed through her recollection of the game so far.

"Unfortunately, it has begun to feel as if Archie may indeed simply be a member of Town playing in a way I don't find credible. One must put aside one's biases and expectations of 'good' play when evaluating others and their agendas, I suppose.

"With that said, I'm not confident of any other scumreads. My partner is pressing lightly for us to vote for Burhalla, Kichiro or Altair, but isn't confident, and I'm not eager to vote for any of them myself. I'm still not convinced Archie is Town, and if we lose a Mailman – which I'm sure he is – it's not a grievous loss, but it also wouldn't tell us much! And I'm not suspicious of Dorien, but neither do I have much confidence that he is Town. It is a difficult choice to make...

"And I must make it alone. [hovertext="Yellow is on a cruise ship with her husband!]Alas, my partner would seem to have fallen into stupor.[/hovertext] It falls to me alone to continue the game for us both for the foreseeable future. I shall do my best."


Lurosa looked up at the expanse above, and folded her tails over her paws again, becoming statue-like in her repose.

"I am fatigued. I would like a tally of the votes cast thus far. I shall make a decision by nightfall."
 

Panoramic_Vacuum

Hoenn around
Partners
  1. aggron
  2. lairon
Based on my review of the mailman discussion from D1 and the resulting play from today, the readlist is:

Solid Townread:
windskull - solid engagement in the mailman debate, lots of theory crafting and a good bit of caution
DawningWinds - aggressive play is what I remember from their townplay in the previous game, and role claim today that is corroborated by wind and HelloJackie's messages
HelloJackie - also part of this trio of corroborated stories with the message swaps from today. I'm inclined to believe based on their spat with DW on D1 that this is genuine townies being confused and going at each other

Slightly less solid Townread:
Inke - good takes on the mailman debacle, and solid reasoning and theory crafting. different play than previous games, but for good reasons as stated
DragonFree - involved in the mailman debacle, was forthcoming with the info, concerned about getting off track, feels towny but then again I can't read Free well so

Slightly slightly less Townread:
Chibi - good takes, but plays really close to the vest. Likes to say "I know something!" but never really explains or hints at why or how...
Starlight - mailman debacle, actually is a mailman, unsure of alignment and play is inconsistent. This isn't wholly weird for Starlight based on past games, and the one-good-one-bad mailman theory was started by a known TP...

Null (b/c they aren't doing much):
Abra - literally hasn't done much. Mudsdale debacle felt genuine to me, not indicative of scum from just that but also, please join in the game! Even if you're unsure, your ideas could inspire someone else.
Virgil - really hasn't said much (especially in the mailman discussion). Haven't played with them before so unsure if they're just quiet or...?

Sus (for reasons stated below):
Bench - very nearly in the Null category, but after reviewing the mailman discussion from D1, they almost always chimed in just to say "I agree with [person]." Combine that with their lack of play, even RP, which I remember seeing much more of in their other games, I'm inclined to vote today or press more tomorrow. The surprise softclaim was also odd, but that's the primary reason I'm not voting them today.
Sind - We kind of went at it today (sorry I did come off as snippy, apologies for that, not my intention, was just frustrated in general. your post was the straw that broke the Camerupt's back [[Abra this isn't a coded message lol]]), but that inspired me to do the backread of the D1 mailman discussion, and I found that a lot of her posts were rehashes of things that had already been said, sometimes multiple times. As the basis for our disagreement today was over the "unhelpfulness" of posts, I wanted to go back and see how much theory crafting came out of it, and honestly it was less than I thought, which is why she's landing here. I do know big summary posts are her thing, but she's used them both as town and as scum... (As I was typing the mailman summary post and this readlist up, I see that two other of my more town-read players are also suspicious...)


Vote: Sinderella
 

Sinderella

Angy Tumbleweed
Staff
Location
In Guzma's Closet
Pronouns
She/Her
Partners
  1. sylveon-shiny
  2. gothitelle
  3. froslass
  4. chandelure
  5. mimikyu
[[Okay, what lol.

I guess I'm sorry for trying to defend myself today against some null/sussy reads on me? I think only my most recent two posts were "defensive" so to speak, so I'm having a hard time with the sentiment that I'm so "preoccupied with defending myself." Yeah, I got a little salty that Pano specifically called me out for my read on them when there were similar reads about them already posted, I'll own that. PMS is a hell of thing kekw. But what, other players can defend themselves (or barely so in some cases) but I do it and I'm the sussy baka? Weirdfuckingchamp.

Well, since we're less than an hour from EoD, I'm going to shoot a pressure vote on Virgil/Kichiro because the more I dwell on the smoke blowiness of their posts, the more iffy I feel--def most sussy of my expansive fucking null list and I seriously just want a lot more out of them. Bench's unsolicited drop of their ability is also putting up flags but I think Virgil is taking my priority at the moment. Arguments have been presented in regard to Abra that I actually agree with (haha daytalk I didn't consider) so I'm leaving that stone alone for now.

Since I lead the vote I have no problem revealing my role. I know it was advised against but I guess I have nothing to lose. It probably will not help me because my role does absoluuuuttteeeellllyyyyyyyy nothing to discern my alignment, but at the very least maybe it'll clear the air about some things that have been thrown around. Or make it worse, considering the theories. I damn fucking well know I'm town, so honestly, fuck it.]]]]
 

Flyg0n

Flygon connoisseur
Pronouns
She/her
Partners
  1. flygon
  2. swampert
  3. ho-oh
  4. crobat
  5. orbeetle
  6. joltik
  7. salandit
  8. tyrantrum
  9. porygon
[[Endlessly frustrated because I have been rereading everything and I don't feel like I am getting any suss-y vibes from anyone, which is pretty rare for me.

The only thing I have is Bench but I still don't feel ready to vote for them.

And I just don't even see any threads to pull on. Very frusterated

@IFBench Can you elaborate on why you chose to sort of out of blue mention an aspect of your power?]]
 

Starlight Aurate

Ad Jesum per Mariam | pfp by kintsugi
Location
Route 123
Partners
  1. mightyena
  2. psyduck
[[...sssssomehow this is the first time I'm actually loading the Absorber page on the wiki, I thought for sure I would have read it during Namo's game??? Also I was somehow under the impression that it was a 90% mafia role like strengthener, where it could ""technically"" be any alignment but but almost always scum. But apparently there's so such association. My life is a lie.]]
"So an Innocent Absorber, eh? Could be powerful, but not if their new ability is just to send out mail."

I'd like to formally point out that I summaryposted in Banquet (which I don't think you played) and was Town, so please don't let that obscure your reads on me
[[Nope! Didn't play Banquet and haven't looked over it. Thanks for pointing that out!]]

So I guess you can see it two ways; yeah I'm once again latching onto something somewhat innocuous (also for reasons I specified previously; Abra also dug at me for a really small comment in Role Overdrive and it felt targeted again, and it tracks with their jumpy scumplay), but Abra also basically did the same goddamn thing I did with much less reason to lol.
Archie smiled. "Not too secure about yourself, are you, pretty boy? And neither is that Garchomp, I see. We'll see how you both hold up under pressure."

Also I wanted to respond to this just because I know firsthand (lololololol) that Absorber held onto everything they got (at least thats how it was in Role Overdrive).
"That game had a different host, though, didn't it? Whereas this--"he waved a hand in the air--"has something else controlling our powers. Might go under the same rules, might not."

[[I really like this theory, and I think it makes a lot of sense. Sending silly messages that don't seem to mean anything feels more appropriate for a third party than any other faction. Also, from a game design perspective, it makes sense to include a role that's motivated to send nonsense if you're doing an "Oops all mailmen" setup.]]
[[Oh my GOSH that's extremely infuriating if that is the case. I'm not opposed to this theory but grrrrr]]

Incidentally, because I kept forgetting about this while posting: a couple people have prodded at Jet asking me what I knew about Karo today. This is simply because in my public short readlist at the end of D1, I had Karo listed as likely town based on a read I didn’t want to elaborate on. As I explained in response, that read was that he was a mailman, and that he was probably a town rather than mafia mailman based on him being the first person to suggest there might be one on each side. He turned out third-party, obviously (but I’m still a fan of the theory he was a mailman)
[[I saw this when I went back and looked at your posts, hence why I didn't ask again. If I live to tonight, and there's one less message than we've had before, then it looks more like Karo was a Mailman.]]

Since we're in the mood to soft claim, I might as well back this up by saying my role does not provide me with active feedback.
"A 'no-feedback' role, huh, Champion? What are you, immune to nightkills? Another one of those Mailmen? Is there a Doctor in the house?"





[[Okay the tl;dr from me is that I still don't feel too good about Sind, Inke, or Abra.I feel a little bit better about Chibi buuuuut I'm still more confused than anything. I know a lot of people trust you, but... I just don't know. The whole "I believe this, but I'm not saying why!" just doesn't really endear me to you.]]

[[And oh CRAP it's 30 minutes from EOD. I'm leaving my vote on AbraPunk. I just don't feel like I have reason to trust you and you haven't said or done much to defend yourself. Is it doing anything now? No, but at least I'm committing to what I started and I hope this makes a statement.]]
"Well, I can certainly believe you believing this, at least. But I don't agree in the slightest about a Mailman's value to Town. There are some uses, certainly, but sending a message doesn't prove you're Town, it doesn't guarantee your message will end up in a Townie's hands, and a Mailman has no special information to disclose secretly. Any instructions a Town Mailman tries to convey may be taken as a trick by a Mafia Mailman. If I had received your message, it wouldn't have convinced me you were an ally, and knowing you trust me wouldn't change how the following day plays out. Meanwhile, the roles I listed before can provide actual utility for Town. Doctors can prevent eliminations, Cops can identify alignments, Trackers and Watchers can catch Mafia in the act of murder, and Vigilantes can contribute to Town-controlled kills. These actions can win the game. Mailmen... What can they say to anyone that would be more dangerous to Mafia than any of the above?"
Unfortunately, it has begun to feel as if Archie may indeed simply be a member of Town playing in a way I don't find credible. One must put aside one's biases and expectations of 'good' play when evaluating others and their agendas, I suppose.
*sad pirate noises*
 

Virgil134

PMD Writer
Partners
  1. sylveon
  2. weavile
  3. kommo-o
  4. noivern
  5. mothim
[[ Hey, I'm back. Feeling a bit better now after taking a step back.

Gonna keep it brief and cast my vote:

Vote: Sinderella

Rationale? Well, let's look at what Inke said about me:

He has been making decently large posts but something I noticed about them is that they're straight up unhelpful. He's not really making any new observations, just basic parroting of the information we already know with very simple "this is weird", or "I agree with this".

This is exactly what Sind has been doing the whole time, including in her post following Inke's where she mentioned being suspicious of me as well. Glad others are now calling her out for it as well, since that genuinely irked me this morning. Especially when I'm not even doing the stuff that Inke claims. :/

[[So I won't have too much time to check in on the thread before the final hour hits.

I'm going to stick to my guns here and vote for Virgil, as I've felt that his presence has been generally unproductive and his defence left much to be desired.
Vote: Kichiro]]

Not really sure why you're so focused on me. You say that I'm parroting and don't make any new observations, but you don't really give any examples or explain why you feel that way. I guess me bringing up the Absorber and narrowing it down to two people just doesn't count? I also think you've been suspiciously silent about Sind, who actually has been doing the stuff you claim I'm doing. If she turns out to be mafia I'm definitely keeping my eye on you on D3. ]]
 

Sinderella

Angy Tumbleweed
Staff
Location
In Guzma's Closet
Pronouns
She/Her
Partners
  1. sylveon-shiny
  2. gothitelle
  3. froslass
  4. chandelure
  5. mimikyu
Sind - We kind of went at it today (sorry I did come off as snippy, apologies for that, not my intention, was just frustrated in general. your post was the straw that broke the Camerupt's back [[Abra this isn't a coded message lol]]), but that inspired me to do the backread of the D1 mailman discussion, and I found that a lot of her posts were rehashes of things that had already been said, sometimes multiple times. As the basis for our disagreement today was over the "unhelpfulness" of posts, I wanted to go back and see how much theory crafting came out of it, and honestly it was less than I thought, which is why she's landing here. I do know big summary posts are her thing, but she's used them both as town and as scum... (As I was typing the mailman summary post and this readlist up, I see that two other of my more town-read players are also suspicious...)
[[Holy dear fucking god fuck me and fuck this; my hormones are shooting through my head LMAO. Forgive me, I'm not mad I am just in a hormonal rage and I'm gonna explode because i don't want to get fucking voted out like this I will cry my goddamn eyes out goddammit

I'm the other Mailman y'all!!! That's why I was kinda meh in that discussion because I didn't want to say too much and get my ass ru-vealed (THATS NOT A CODE I'M WATCHING RUPAUL TAKE IT EZ LMAOOOO). I also think I put too much emphasis on how much this stupid role mattered because it's town's only line of communication so to speak, but it's clearly not that deep.

I sent the messages to Pano and Starlight--Starlight's specifically said "It's a beautiful day in the neighborhood" (Starlight your response made me laugh and I wish I could have reacted lmfaooooooo) and for Pano's I actually had to edit theirs because I damn near put "There's so many goddamn pirates in this game" but I thought that sounded too much like me so I edited it.

Kind of like our friend who's typing their posts in a fruit-vendorish fashion, my goal was to also put some pokes out to see if my letters got swapped or blocked or whatever the fuck, and it fucking figures I message another mailman. I didn't have any special information to divulge so I figured that was the best I could do for the time being, and this upcoming night I was just planning to say this in my next message. Never played this role before and really didn't know what to do, didn't even think to play off like an actual fruit vendor role like this other smartass did, so I figured I'd just send completely irrelevant things and see if I could catch a swap or a block or SOMETHING.

Once again I know this isn't indicative of my role whatsoever but again, and I cannot stress this enough, I AM A MOTHERFUCKING TOWNIE, and I'll scream it from the FUCKING ROOFTOP because UUURRRHGHGHHGHGHGHGHJHeqP P'OEIP'WQO[ I'm so aggravated I dropped the ball I'm so sorry kekwkekwkekw.]]
 

NeoLurosa

Junior Trainer
Pronouns
J:they/them HY:she
[[Too damn tired and out of time. Thought it over, and even if Archie is scum, he's definitely a Mailman and I'd rather look for info on more dangerous roles and stealthy players.]]

Lurosa grimaced, clearly uncomfortable. "I choose to vote for... Dorien."
 

NeoLurosa

Junior Trainer
Pronouns
J:they/them HY:she
[[Yo what the fuck. This is no good for my odds of good sleep, huh. Fuckssake, uh... I need to think about this. 20 minutes left. Fuck. What timing.]]
 

NeoLurosa

Junior Trainer
Pronouns
J:they/them HY:she
[[Why do we have TWO people claiming to be Townie Mailmen who are being incredibly cagey about their messages? And neither of them is the wannabe Fruit Vendor, even? What are the fucking odds of three Townie Mailmen in a single game? This is a weird fucking setup, I swear to god.]]
 

Flyg0n

Flygon connoisseur
Pronouns
She/her
Partners
  1. flygon
  2. swampert
  3. ho-oh
  4. crobat
  5. orbeetle
  6. joltik
  7. salandit
  8. tyrantrum
  9. porygon
[[What the actual heck. Either we do have three mailmen in this setup which is baffling and confsing or there's some very strange scum theatre thats just unrealistic.

WHat is this.

I guess in a regular game three mailmen isn't unrealistic, since this isn't role madness? UGH

I think I might just vote for Bench honestly, so sorry buddy]]
 

Sinderella

Angy Tumbleweed
Staff
Location
In Guzma's Closet
Pronouns
She/Her
Partners
  1. sylveon-shiny
  2. gothitelle
  3. froslass
  4. chandelure
  5. mimikyu
[[I'm so fucking dead fucking ass y'all I am town I am mailman, y'all are making a big fucking mistake voting me out--Mailman doesn't crroborate me for SHIT, I KNOW, all I was trying to do was catch a swap or a block or some movement and I thought I was so BIG BRAINED i swear i swear. I didn't know what else to do but hand to the fucking sky I'm town, and I was keeping myself lowkey because I didn't want to say some shit and out myself.

What was cagey about my messages?? What would you like me to say, I stated what the contents of my messages were and why I wrote them lmao. Also stated why I had little to offer in the damn mailman back and forth I WAS A FUCKING MAILMAN.

I'm town. I swear to fucking god I'm town.]]
 

Panoramic_Vacuum

Hoenn around
Partners
  1. aggron
  2. lairon
[[What the heck???? So... wait Sind you're claiming the spam nonsense messages and not the item ones? What is going on. Oh my god the "oops all mailmen" shitpost isn't a shitpost any more.

I'm still like, really confused as to how Sind went about her play leading up to EoD today... what on earth?????]]
 

Starlight Aurate

Ad Jesum per Mariam | pfp by kintsugi
Location
Route 123
Partners
  1. mightyena
  2. psyduck
[[Uhm okay hwhat.

Sooooo Sike was not the one sending the nonsense messages (she could've sent the item-themed ones?) and we've got two people claiming to be Townie mailmen? Honestly I think that checks out since mailmen are communicative roles, but three Townie mailmen??? Assuming the item-person is also a Townie???]]

I didn't know what else to do but hand to the fucking sky I'm town, and I was keeping myself lowkey because I didn't want to say some shit and out myself.
[[Saaaaame. Okay, I feel a lot better about Sind because she and I have pretty much the same lines of thought about this whole thing (except that I decided to say nothing at all N0). If anybody wants to join me on the bandwagon for AbraPunk, feel free!]]
PMS is a hell of thing kekw
[[TRUTH]]
 

Dragonfree

Moderator
Staff
Location
Iceland
Pronouns
she/her/hers
Partners
  1. butterfree
  2. mightyena
  3. charizard
  4. scyther-mia
  5. vulpix
  6. slugma
  7. chinchou
May scowled. "I'm not buying it. I still think the one who sent those messages was Karo. Why wouldn't you make some attempt to write something more meaningful if you were town? Unless there's something else to corroborate that, my vote's staying."
 
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