Steven had managed to shape the nothingness of the void into something that resembled a writing surface, and had been scratching notes into its surface for the better part of an hour. With a sigh, he finally paused and wiped his hands against his trousers.
"I believe the Floatzel was on to something. These messages, we certainly did talk a lot about them, and at quite some length. I've gone back through and collected our thoughts on the matter not to solve the mystery of the mailmen and who they are, but to see how we all have handled the discussion."
"The first day of discussions went as follows..."
The possibility of multiple mailfolk is interesting. What if one of them's on our side and one isn't?]]
[[The first first message about multiple mailmen after the reveal of two messages that night came from
Sike (a now-confirmed TP and suspected mailperson themself). They also are the first person to suggest different alignments for these mailmen: one town, and one mafia.
"Don't see much use of there being one on the Mafia side though," he added, as if reading the nosspass' thoughts. "Aren't mailmen some form of communication for us innocents? The thing we don't have?" he asked.
[[Inke seems skeptical of Sike's suggestion, wondering why mafia would have a mailman and what utility it would bring to the scum team.]]
"Well yeah, but like. What if they can send messages to us? Messages that are total bs. They could screw with our heads," Karo suggested.
[[Sike suggests that the mafia would use their mailman to send false info to the town.]]
Neo blinked at the big spiky cat and sent a wave of telepathy his way. What if there was a bad guy mailman, and their goal was to mislead people?
[[NeoLurosa expresses concern about the potential for a misleading scum mailman, also arriving to a similar idea as Sike.]]
We could have one mailmon that delivers multiple messages, or two separate ones. One could be on our side, one could be on the other to throw us off.. Trick us. Or they could both be good. I can't see them both being bad. That would feel... weak."
"Like I said. There's a chance one of our carriers is looking to deceive us. Though... I wouldn't work under the assumption that one must be bad."
[[Wind offers the idea of one person sending both messages, or not. Also wonders about opposite factions, or if both mailmen (if there were two) were town. Doesn't think both would be scum. Agrees there's a chance of one scum, but not that there has to be a scum mailman.]]
[[Ooooooooooooooooo that's a very good observation; wouldn't be surprised if each side had one, but I also don't want to fully dig my heel into that idea just yet]]
[[Sind chimes in, agreeing with the previous posters of a possible good/bad mailman. Doesn't want to commit to the idea yet.]]
"I don't think it was a code, just a nonsense phrase. My theory from before stands: I think someone innocent was just sending a message to let us know that a mailman--or mailmen--exists."
[[Starlight (a now-claimed mailman) wonders if the message(s) were simply to alert the group to the existence of the role.]]
[[My thoughts are pretty much summed up by Sike/Windskull. Looks like we've got two potential mailmen (or just one who can send multiple messages?) and so far, that's all we've got to go off of. Both Free and I claim our messages were not useful and had no context.]]
[[Starlight then commits to the idea of two mailmen, offering that it's possible there is just one.]]
[[Don't have much to add. I agree with Sike, Windskull, and Starlight.]]
[[Bench chimes in to simply agree with everyone else.]]
“So, two messages received; two couriers. Or a single courier that can send two messages, perhaps. Did anybody else come to witness anything that they feel safe to share?"
[[Sind rehashes the idea of two vs one mailman. Wonders if it's safe to reveal/share more.]]
"I don't want to ask anyone to reveal too much, but would there be any way to see if the messages are similar, or related? Could it be code broken into several pieces? Or is one message a cipher for the other?" He frowned.
"Or could they be interpreted as a warning, a way to mark a target?"
[[I pose the idea of comparing the messages to see if they are related. Wonders about a coded message, or potentially a way to mark targets.]]
"I beg your pardon, but I'm not sure I'm ready to assuredly credit the idea that there are two 'mailman' players, just yet," she said, lightly. "With so many roles available, and given the nature of 'role madness', I would be a little surprised if there were duplicate roles in play, hm... It's possible, I grant, but there is another explanation for two messages – besides that one or both recipients might be untruthful! – namely, one message may have been sent by a Parrot. I note that this role is among the list of valid powers. I would caution against drawing firm conclusions with so little evidence available."
[[HelloJackie is skeptical of two mailmen, surprised if there were duplicate roles in play. First to suggest Parrot theory.]]
Now if only everyone could get mail. It sounded like said mail was basically just spam, but it could be good for a laugh, at least.
[[Sike jokes about getting mail, is the first one to offer the term of "spam" in relation to the nonsense messages, maybe as a joke.]]
[[PARROTS, I forgot about parrots. That's actually a really plausible explanation. Of course, now I wonder if the messages sent are duplicates or if the parrot gets to come up with their own message.]]
[[Sike then latches onto Parrot theory and wonders how that might work.]]
Her gaze turned next to May and Archie. "You could each day the first few letters of the message you received. If they're the same, then they likely either came from the same person, or a parrot. I'd they're different... Well, we don't learn too much, but it could be valuable information. However..."
She closed her eyes again and let out a sigh. "One of you could be lying about receiving a message, though I doubt it at this time. Or you could lie about the contents. Then there's the question of whether we want confirmation of a parrot at this point at all."
[[Wind offers a way to compare the messages to test Parrot theory. Then wonders if someone is lying about receiving a message, or its contents. Then wonders if we even should try to find out if there is a Parrot in play.]]
Neo cocked his head to the side as he listened to the Slice-Cat. Maybe someone could be lying, but why would they? Wouldn’t that be risky for a bad guy to try? And why wouldn’t everyone want to know if there was a parrot around?
[[HelloJackie is skeptical of someone lying, seems like a bad idea for a mafia member to try. The wonders why we
wouldn't want to know if a Parrot was in play.]]
[[Maybe they can both reveal the first and last word? Or perhaps the longest word of their respective message? Idk I feel like it’d be so easy for one to copy another if one of them is indeed lying.
Lol, count total words of the messages? Or syllables? That could be at least a semi-decent clue if they got the same message or not.
Ofc I don’t want to feel like we’re beating a dead Mudsdale here, especially if it turns out the messages are in fact just useless, but I do think it is helpful to at least try to confirm the existence of some roles a la multiple mailmen, or a mailman and a parrot, etc. etc.]]
[[Sind suggests the same way to reveal the messages as Wind as well as several others. Wonders if the messages are useless, or are intended to confirm the existence of the mailmen role. Also this is the origin of the Mudsdale incident (lol)]]
"The problem with that theory is that a parrot uses a person's action on themselves. So if that was why both of us got a message, that'd mean one of us is the one who's sending messages in the first place. I know I'm not. I didn't think the pirate guy sounded like he was, either."
[[Free expresses doubt about how Parrot theory works from a gameplay standpoint. Claims they are not a mailman. Thinks Starlight probably isn't either.]]
"It would be risky," Muse admitted. "But it's not unheard of for a bad guy to lie about getting something, or lie about whet they received. I'll fully admit that doing so this early in the game would be dangerous, and it's for that reason that, while I wanted to address the possibility, it is rather unlikely that either of the strange simipour are lying.
"As for my concern with revealing the information right away... In the most basic scenario where there is no bus driver, that would mean one of our two recipients is the mailman, which in theory would narrow down who might have a more...lucrative role to target for the bad guys. I was going to suggest that if we went through with asking, neither claim that they are or aren't the mailman to make it harder to guess, but... I was a little late to do so. Apologies."
[[Wind reiterates that it's possible someone is lying about the message or its contents, but that it is risky and doesn't think anyone is lying. Goes on to theorize about revealing who is the mailman could provide targets for the mafia (or eliminate potential targets from the pool of more powerful roles. Suggests no one actually claims the role outright.]]
"Please, correct me if I'm wrong," Steven began, "My head still hurts quite a bit... But if I'm understanding the situation, is it also possible that neither message recipient is the Mailman, and we have two other people here who can send messages at night? Or one other person who can send multiple messages? And no Parrot at all?"
[[I wonder if neither recipient is a mailman at all, and am unsure if there are one or two alternate senders of said messages, and also suggest no Parrot.]]
[[Been brought up quite a bit while I was asleep, but I feel that we need to hear from both Free and Starlight. If it's a Parrot, that means one of them is our mailman but I don't want to subscribe to that theory just yet. More I think about it, more I believe that this mailman can send multiple messages as it has been known to be able to use their ability more than once per night. Though again, baseless speculation.]]
[[Inke leans more into the single mailman with multiple sending powers theory, but says it is pure speculation.]]
Anyway TLDR is that I’m not convinced there’s two mailmen and I think something else or another messaging-type role is in play, and if for some reason there are two mailmen then it’s almost certain that one of them are scum because two town mailmen makes zero sense to me.
—Yellow]]
[[HelloJackie is certain it is only one mailman and some other messaging role. Also is certain if there are two, they have to be opposing alignments. Does not know why there would be two town mailmen.]]
Yellow's post makes sense, I think? Having duplicate roles isn't out of the question, considering it wasn't specifically called out as a condition that wouldn't be in the game. (Heal clash was called out as not happening, but not that there couldn't be two Doctors, per se). It does feel weird though given the big list of roles we got...
With the Parrot theory, Free denied being a Mailman, but did she deny being a Parrot? Is having a Parrot hard claimed a good or a bad thing? How about a Mailman? I guess what I'm getting at is are we giving some nice, juicy targets for the scum to pick off by going down this road? Though I have no idea what other road we have to be going down.
[[I agree with Yellow's post, reiterating that two mailmen is possible on the grounds that duplicate roles are not explicitly called out as not existing in the game (per the rules post), but having duplicates does feel weird. Wonders if Free might be the Parrot, and if us figuring out who is what role is helpful to town or not.]]
“Maybe one mailman sent two letters or maybe there’s two mailmen and they also can do other cool stuff cuz they have custom powers,” Jet said, flicking her tails. “Even if the letters are different, we still wouldn’t know. All I know is the parrot’s gotta copy the same guy they visit. But I don’t think the blue-haired girl is a parrot anyway.”
Jet tilted her head at the Luxray’s Voice. “Even if those humans got the same letter, it’s not like there’s gotta be a parrot. Maybe some guy just sent two letters. Anyway why do we wanna figure out their power without them tellin us? That’s like us doing the bad guys’ job for them.”
[[Chibi rehashes where we've landed with mailman theory, but says they don't think Free is a Parrot. Also is worried about figuring out the roles as being helpful to mafia and hurtful to town.]]
I don't think its impossible for this mailman or whatnot to be able to possibly send two messages? Assuming everyone is telling the truth about getting a message, and Free isn't lying, which I doubt.
Alternately, Isn't it possible jack of all trades could have Mailman powers?
[[Tetra posts (hope you feel better!) Rehashes mailman theory but then suggests JOAT as a potential one-time mailman.]]
I think I’m ready to ditch the Parrot theory for now, at least to explain the two letters, because it just doesn’t work. It’s very possible we have a JOAT mailman—I forgot we might have a JOAT in the game and that seems reasonable.
[[HelloJackie wants to ditch Parrot theory. Likes the idea of JOAT being a potential explanation for the second message.]]
"Yeah. The parrot thing was just raised as an explanation for there being two messages when having two people with the same role seems weird." May frowned. "It is kind of weird, but I can think of ways that could be true. Maybe a couple different people have messaging as a side power, or something. Or it's just that one's town and the other's mafia."
[[Free also wants to dismiss Parrot theory. Says having duplicate roles is weird, but not unheard of. Also suggests the one town/one mafia theory of two mailmen again.]]
"The sense I'm getting is the messages were sent by two different people. If it was the same one, if they're going to write a random quote in one, wouldn't they probably do a quote in the other one too? Mine's not a quote. Actually I think mine might have been from the mafia mailman, because if you took it at face value you might think it's a gameplay effect, but I'm pretty sure it's not. Maybe it's just someone fooling around, but maybe they're trying to mislead people."
[[Free believes the messages did come from two different senders. Wonders if their message came from the mafia mailman because it's at least related to gameplay, but not actually gameplay.]]
[[This is pretty much what I though. It's good to hear your thoughts regarding the situation. And it's definitely something to be aware of. With the possiblity of a mafia mailman, I don't think we should take any claims of identity in the messages at face value without some form of proof.
[[Wind also subscribes to mafia mailman theory, worries about identity claims because of this.]]
[[I'm not sure if I can fully subscribe to the idea of a Mafia mailman because it feels...weak. If there is one with the intent to deceive/throw off Town, then I don't get why the message would contain nonsense (though we'd probably need a wider pool than just N0 to try to confirm this). As a whole I feel that this entire convo regarding mailmen has been on the more unproductive side seeing that it's mostly speculation at this point. The messages being different doesn't confirm that they weren't sent by the same person.
Parrot theory can probably be thrown out the window though. Not dismissing the possibility of there being one in the game entirely, but if there is, they didn't use their action on the mailman.
[[Inke uncertain about mafia mailman theory. Unsure why a misleading message would contain nonsense, and thinks the mailman talk has been unproductive. Different messages don't necessarily mean different senders. Also wants to ditch Parrot theory.]]
[[Aaaaalllllright so I'm set on scrapping the Parrot theory for now based on this; down to single Mailman with double send or two separate Mailmen. I can't really side with either because on one hand, I see a world where one Mailman decides to send messages with wildly different contents (for some reason ig maybe just tryna flaunt their existence in some way), but I could also see two different Mailmen being on two different wavelengths and sending completely different things, especially if they're on opposing teams. I don't know. It's a little hard to really say without knowing the full context of the messages (but for the love of god maybe don't reveal them yet I'm just saying kekw).
[[Sind chimes in that she also wants to ditch Parrot theory. Reiterates the one vs two mailman theory, unsure of which one because different message contents =/= different senders, or different alignments of the senders. Doesn't commit to anything without knowing the full context of the messages, but asks them not to reveal.]]
[[Don't have much to say, other than that the parrot theory does sound very complex, and not probable. I think it's more likely we either have two postmen, a postman who can naturally act twice, or someone used a power on the postman that lets them act twice.]]
[[Bench chimes in to say they don't have much to say, and again reiterates Parrot theory is confusing and the one vs two mailman theory. Then suggests possible motivation as a reason a single mailman could act twice.]]
"Couldn't agree more," he said to Karo. "I don't know which is more ridiculous, the fact that this keeps happening, or that apparently everyone here is a pirate."
[[Just putting this here as this is the conversation I had with Sike (all RP) about having all the pirates in this game, and seems to be the context of the message I received last night.]]
[I guess the message senders probably wouldn't have a goal right now, would they? Other than to let everyone know that they exist? I can see how message sending would definitely be useful, but on N0 nobody knows anything about anyone yet.]]
[[Starlight again wonders about the motives of sending the message, and if it was simply to alert the group to the mailman's presence.]]
[[Oh, I didn't think of a strengthener! I do think that last one is least probable, just because I don't think anyone would hasten another player on N0 without know anything about each other.]]
[[Is interested by Bench's suggestion of a motivator (Starlight is later corrected by Inke that it's not a strengthener but a motivator that would accomplish this).]]
I don't have any thoughts on the whole message thing given that it doesn't tell us a whole lot at this point in time, so I don't know what else we can do. ]]
[[Virgil chimes in saying he doesn't have any thoughts and is unsure of what to do with the whole mailman thing.]]
[[I have precious little to contribute at the moment. bad week.
@Dragonfree I believe you said you wouldn't reveal the actual contents of the note yet, right? In which case I doesn't much matter what was said I guess, at least right now.
The whole mailman thing seems like a moot point.
[[Tetra also seems interested in dismissing the mailman discussion.]]
I don't have many thoughts on the mailman situation that haven't otherwise been stated; double mailmen seems more likely to me than single mailmen by a hair though.
[[DawningWinds posts and says they have no additional thoughts either. Says double mailman is maybe more likely than single.]]
Okay, so. Day ending soon. All we know is that two messages happened for some reason. My theories at this point re: that are that either we have two mailpeople or else maybe one mailperson and a jack of all trades who sent a message last night, too. (Although, why use up your message shot so early, when you know nothing other than what you are?) At any rate, it tells me precisely fuck all about who's scum and who ain't.
[[Sike reiterates the two vs one mailperson and a JOAT, but wonders why a JOAT would use their one-shot mail power on N0.]]
[[ I do worry someone could lie about the mailman thing, except that should be a bad idea right? Except it seems like someone could just.... pretend to have received a message but want to keep is secret for now?
[[Tetra worried about lying, though says it seems like a bad idea.]]
[[Probably not? It wouldn't seem smart, you'd expect the same amount of messages to presumably be sent the next night so you'd expect someone else to be able to confirm the messages later. Though it might be a tad safer in a game where roles don't flip so someone could just try to argue that the mailman probably died.]]
[[DW agrees it's probably not smart to lie, and it would be corroborated by number of messages on the next night, unless a mailman is eliminated.]]
[[Unless scum somehow knew they killed a mailman and are pretending its still around to coast by as town.
[[Tetra theorizes that scum could know they killed a mailman and would roleclaim for credibility.]]
[[Receiving a message isn't town indicative though?
And I don't think that makes sense. Trying to argue the Namo was a mailman makes sense to cover such a lie, but it would only work if Namo wasn't actually a mailman because kills usually go last, so the number of messages received would go down by two instead of one.]]
[[DW uncertain of Tetra's theory, also says receiving a message isn't indicative of town.]]
"Anyway," May said, "I've been thinking and I think I should tell you why I'm leery of my message at least before the day ends. The message said, 'Congratulations! You have received an [item]!' Only unless I'm blind I'm not seeing, you know, the actual item. It's just a message. That's why I felt like it might be trying to mislead. Or it might not."
[[Please disregard the bit where apparently I missed that there was an "an" there when I described the contents of the message. ~_~
Anyway. I am pretty sure that if there is an actual item mechanic it would come in the form of bold text in the actual mod message, and not just being told you received a message that says you got an item. In case I die tonight, I want to preempt the possibility that others receive messages like this and take it at face value and start talking about an item mechanic that probably doesn't actually exist. If it is trying to mislead about an item mechanic, that absolutely sounds like a thing a mafia mailman might do. On the other hand, maybe it's just somebody trying to be cute, who didn't realize it could be interpreted as a mechanical thing.]]
[[Free reveals the contents of her message, warns that it could be scum misleading, and the item mechanic doesn't seem like a real mechanic, so don't waste time debating it.]]
[[(There's also the possibility that the mailmen are not allowed to actually pick their message and instead it's restricted, e.g. a mailman who can only send messages about giving items and all they can choose is which item, or a mailman who can only send messages that appear on an IMDb quotes page, or whatever.)]]
[[Free suggests maybe the mailman messages are pre-selected. (this seems to have been debunked in the message from D2 stating a character limit on the message, also the fact that the messages were different from D1s messages)]]
I'm trying to find a way that bringing up the question of night messages would benefit scum when the only other message we know about (that Starlight received) is just a quote from a TV show? That wouldn't feed false info, and using an open question during the day to ID a message recipient of a scum mailman would be weird because scum should already know who is and isn't on their side.
[[I wonder how nonsense messages would benefit the scum team, since scum should already know their targets, they wouldn't need a message to ID recipients.]]
The only reason I could see sussing Free is that by bringing up the messages, the intention was purely to waste our time (which it kind of did, but at the same time now we know there is a mailman in the game, perhaps two, and that's more info than we had prior).
[[I throw potential sus at Free for using the mailman discussion as a time waster, though wonder if it was a waste in the first place since we know the mailman exists now.]]
[[I thought about this too, like in Humble Vale when there were only a few phrases each messaging role could send. I'm trying to wrap my head around the utility of the role if it were restricted like this. If the messages are nonsense, at best it could act like a bus driver check, and at worst they simply alert the game to their presence. I guess the worst might be if it were a scum role, it's meant to waste time?]]
[[I agree with Free about the potential of pre-selected messages, and maybe the mailman can use their messages as a way to check for swaps. Wonder if the utility for a scum mailman is simply for time-wasting.]]
[[lol beat me to it. There are two custom roles in this game per the sign up post, maybe one of those is related to this? Or is some kind of modified fruit vendor? The kind of janky nonsense of both messages makes it feel like a spam email or something. Would a spam mailman role exist to throw off the usefulness of a real mailman?]]
[[I point out that the second message sender could be a custom role and not a mailman. The idea of spam mail comes up again here as a way to make a town mailman less useful. Fruit vendor is also brought up, but Free points out it is not on the list of roles in the game.]]
What's mailmans usual utility? I guess its a decent way to communicate between known town members. But if its restricted then what good would it be? Maybe this message was just sent to test... ]]
[[Tetra wonders about mailman's utility for town.]]
[[I think at this point, it’s best to just let the mailman thing rest since we aren’t getting anywhere with it for now. The fact that both of these messages sound nonsensical makes me think that they were both some sort of test? But of course we can’t be too careful, it’s possible the item or the quote means something…I dunno. There doesn’t appear to be any clear code, as far as I can tell.
[[HelloJackie wants to drop the mailman topic. Worried the item quote does mean something, but no way to know for sure. Definitely not coded messages.]]
Starlight Aurate (Archie): I feel like you've been a little less forthcoming about the nature of your message than Dragonfree (May). This, combined with the fact that you weren't the first to claim receiving a message, has kind of left me wondering if there really was a second message.
[[Sike thows some sus at Starlight for potentially hiding their message contents and claiming second. Wonders if there even was a second message. This is debunked by the presence of multiple messages on D2.]]
[[Yeah, as I was saying, my working assumption is there is not actually an item. The mod message told me I got a message and then quoted the message, which was that. I doubt that's how it would be presented if there are genuine items in the game. That's why I think the message may be intentionally misleading.
I am a little miffed that nobody at all has engaged with my reasoning about this? I do really hope it doesn't get overlooked, I will be yelling in deadchat if I die and then people start talking about items/assuming the person sending items is town.
[[Free reiterates that she is suspect of the item mechanic mentioned in her message and to not get sucked in to talking about it, and that it seems deliberately misleading.]]
[[I agree. Receiving an item would be expected to be announced clearly and differently than a message. I didn't engage with it previously because there didn't seem to be a point in making a post just saying this but since you're worried about it being overlooked I figured I might toss in my entirely nonunique two cents.]]
[[DW chimes in on why they didn't address the item mechanic that Free was concerned about.]]
Aaaaaand that covers D1. I don't think I'm going to have time to go over the D2 discussion about messages, but we now know that Sike flipped TP, Starlight claimed mailman, and we had three messages today, two of which were swapped via DW's bus driver one-shot power.
Hopefully this is enlightening on who was engaged with what in the discussions, who was theory crafting, and who was repeating info we already knew. And now I need to read any new things that popped up in the thread while I was putting this together.]]
]]
