[TOWN WIN] Darkwhite's Role Overdrive Mafia

[Panoramic_Vacuum]

[[Last post for the day since I'll be asleep during EoD.]]


[[While it is true that it sounds like a waste to trigger the Dread count but Free already stated that she has to choose someone to Dread and I think the best way to confirm it would be having her vote for someone and choosing someone else for the night. This way, we'll have 2 players that can confirm her Dread ability and while this doesn't explicitly clear her of not being Mafia. It gives the marked players a chance to say that their roles have been blocked if she targets the same person in N2 and this might give us a hint on her true alignment. For example, if she's town and she chooses me for N1 to mark for 2 points then she most likely won't choose me again unless she's Mafia.]]

"Hang on, hang on, hang on." Sidney stepped toward the Froslass while waving a hand. "You're sayin' we should purposefully give people dread? Without knowing who they are and what they can do? Are you nuts?"

[[I know you're most likely gone for the day, but I wanted to reply to this bc I don't think this is the best plan with so many unknowns in the game right now. Who's to say that Free will even be able to actually target who she wants every night? If there's so many statues in place, and a Miller in play, the name is the game feels like it's disruption and misdirection.]]

"We should be tryin' to keep dread as low as we can, otherwise we'll all end up blocked or dead!"

[[Since Free's powers at night are not optional, we can't avoid some dead each night. If we're uncertain of who to vote for today, she should abstain to avoid giving out extra dread with her vote. Unless we think we need to see who she votes for to confirm her powers, but I think that's unnecessary. Less dread early in the game means town can avoid accidentally handicapping themselves later on.]]

 

[Persephone]

“Yeah, I don’t know about a god of string. And what’s a Genesect?”

[[Imagine Coco with a gun.]]

“…”

[[It could also be one of the lake trio for the red chain or Calyrex for reigns? A Calyrex player who can fuse with another would make some sense, but why would they attack a miller?]]

“Seriously, what’s a Calyrex?”

[[Pony Necrozma]]

“…forget I asked.”

 

[ShiniGojira]

[[I know I said that was my last post for the day but seeing as I'm not asleep yet...]]

[[I know you're most likely gone for the day, but I wanted to reply to this bc I don't think this is the best plan with so many unknowns in the game right now. Who's to say that Free will even be able to actually target who she wants every night? If there's so many statues in place, and a Miller in play, the name is the game feels like it's disruption and misdirection.]]

[[Oh yeah, I know it wasn't the best plan and that there's definitely a lot of things we don't know. We won't know for certain if Free even has the Dread ability, complex as she made it seem, as we'd only know at the end of a phase. I admit, I haven't considered the idea that she can't choose a target. That does change things a bit if it's randomized. Who's to say the randomized target won't be a Mafia and said scum wouldn't call themselves out to make Free's ability claim seem like a lie. Yeah, yeah, I get that it's a low chance that the randomized target could be a Mafia but...]]

[[Since Free's powers at night are not optional, we can't avoid some dead each night. If we're uncertain of who to vote for today, she should abstain to avoid giving out extra dread with her vote. Unless we think we need to see who she votes for to confirm her powers, but I think that's unnecessary. Less dread early in the game means town can avoid accidentally handicapping themselves later on.]]

[[Less dread is defnitely a good play but you have to consider the sheer number of the lobby. It's a 20 (18 if you're not including Free and if someone dies this night) player lobby and if she doesn't straight-up target someone, it'll be at most 37 nights before she kills one player and 19 nights before an ability gets sealed if she distributes them evenly, and 2-3 nights if she targets someone. Of course, this isn't considering the likehood of her ability targeting randomly 'cause that calculation will be all over the place if I try to calculate it rn.]]

 

[Equitial]

Equi tentaively believes claim.

[[
Mark me as firmly believes claim. I'm suspicious of everyone in Mafia, so thinking someone is "probably friendly" is good for me.
]]

Free now mentions that they received a PM that strings have been attached to character, and somebody else will win if others are affected by it. Possible third party? Theorizes that it might be because they claimed, or if you reveal associated Legendary--caution against revealing unless reason to do so.

[[
Oh, hey, another point in the favor of town!DF. Because of their theory, they are encouraging everyone not to do any roleclaims. This is against the interests of Mafia, who would want to seek and destroy the power roles.
]]

"We should be tryin' to keep dread as low as we can, otherwise we'll all end up blocked or dead!"

BARTHOLOMEW:
-- lol I agree with Cactus man!
-- I like the sentiment of offering yourselves up as labrats, but that isn't necessary!
-- if Dave really is lying, it will come out sooner or later. we don't don't need to find out NOW RIGHT NOW

[[
Equitial:

Yup and, so for today, it looks like we're all heading for no-elimination today with like two and a half hours left (I think), so that's that!

I've actually been managing to take notes today, so I'm going to try to summarize those before EoD. I may not manage, but I'll give it my best effort.
]]

 

[Blossomleaf]

[[Last post for the day since I'll be asleep during EoD.]]


[[While it is true that it sounds like a waste to trigger the Dread count but Free already stated that she has to choose someone to Dread and I think the best way to confirm it would be having her vote for someone and choosing someone else for the night. This way, we'll have 2 players that can confirm her Dread ability and while this doesn't explicitly clear her of not being Mafia. It gives the marked players a chance to say that their roles have been blocked if she targets the same person in N2 and this might give us a hint on her true alignment. For example, if she's town and she chooses me for N1 to mark for 2 points then she most likely won't choose me again unless she's Mafia.]]

"Hang on, hang on, hang on." Sidney stepped toward the Froslass while waving a hand. "You're sayin' we should purposefully give people dread? Without knowing who they are and what they can do? Are you nuts?"

[[I know you're most likely gone for the day, but I wanted to reply to this bc I don't think this is the best plan with so many unknowns in the game right now. Who's to say that Free will even be able to actually target who she wants every night? If there's so many statues in place, and a Miller in play, the name is the game feels like it's disruption and misdirection.]]

"We should be tryin' to keep dread as low as we can, otherwise we'll all end up blocked or dead!"

[[Since Free's powers at night are not optional, we can't avoid some dead each night. If we're uncertain of who to vote for today, she should abstain to avoid giving out extra dread with her vote. Unless we think we need to see who she votes for to confirm her powers, but I think that's unnecessary. Less dread early in the game means town can avoid accidentally handicapping themselves later on.]]

"....Okay hold on, kid. I have to side with the Cacturne here." Nanu interjected while using his 'paw' to essentially facepalm (since he also took note that Shini was going to bed). "Because while I get where you're going with this strategy, It isn't going to work if Dave said all this crap about his ability and how four dread equals us getting our actions locked. While six dread means someone will get eliminated if we don't keep track of the dread count." The Island Kahuna gestured to the "chatot" and guardian device that pulled up Dragonfree's earlier quote onto the screen.

"Patron legendary's Darkrai. Main thing I do is every night I have to pick someone and increase their 'Dread count' by two. Whoever I've voted for at the end of the day has the dread count go up by one, and anyone who targets me in the night has the dread count go up by one. Anyone with a dread count of four can't use their action until it's 'cured', whatever that means. Anyone with a dread count of six gets eliminated. All in all, I can target somebody and they can confirm, assuming I don't get blocked or whatever. I can't just not target anyone."

He dropped the card again with an exasperated sigh. "I've got something else too that I can't say, but why the fuck would you even believe me? Even if we verify the whole dread thing, it's not exactly proof I'm not in the mafia. So this is all basically unfalsifiable bullshit. I'm saying it now because otherwise one of you fuckers is going to try to investigate me and it'll all sound like a hastily assembled excuse and we're all going to waste a fuckload of time."

"...And if that is the case, where Dave is forced to pick someone at night to give two dread counters to, then we're only going to give town a disadvantage and mafia the full advantage the more players get their abilities locked out until they're "cured" by someone else's role, right?" Nanu rubbed his forehead wearily. While really hating the Alolan meowth form when his paw bonked against the gold coin atop his head. That only served to remind me how he's an unwilling participant in this game. "So, ignoring what the Chatot said, I'm inclined to agree with the Cacturne that we keep the dread as low as possible. Since by this point we can just have people mention the next day if they have the dread counters put on them right? Or is that also going to be "against some invisible rule" where we're unable to say that aloud." Nanu speculated as an afterthought.

Before the Island Kahuna decided to leave it at that and look around for some potential spot to take a nap at this point. Since talking about Dave's abilities felt like beating a dead Mudsdale at this point. And it's not like he can prevent players from doing whatever they wanted in this game.

Even if he still stood by the fact that his damn guardian shouldn't be so rash to make decisions for them. As Nanu continued purposefully ignoring the Chatot's "apologetic text messages."

Because she can be "sorry" all she wants. But it's not like she'd suffer from the damn dread count if they went through with Nanu also agreed wasn't a good idea. If the best option was to stay away and avoid Dave entirely for now. Instead of mess around with some strange ability they had no clue what it did. Outside of Dave's 'word' that no one could prove was true or not.

 

[Equitial]

-- I like the sentiment of offering yourselves up as labrats, but that isn't necessary!

[[Oh yeah, I know it wasn't the best plan and that there's definitely a lot of things we don't know. We won't know for certain if Free even has the Dread ability, complex as she made it seem, as we'd only know at the end of a phase. I admit, I haven't considered the idea that she can't choose a target. That does change things a bit if it's randomized. Who's to say the randomized target won't be a Mafia and said scum wouldn't call themselves out to make Free's ability claim seem like a lie. Yeah, yeah, I get that it's a low chance that the randomized target could be a Mafia but...]]

[[
Okay, I know I just said offering yourself up for Dread was something of a townlean, but actually Shini's logic is a bit counterintuitive for me. Since it's EoD, I'm going to leave it, but I'd like to think on this more.

For the Dread-volunteers, I think this only makes sense if you're offering to take DF's night action. She has to do that, so if you think it won't harm town so much if you end up blocked go ahead.
]]

 

[Dragonfree]

“For the record,” Dave cut in, “yes, I can pick who I target with it. I just can’t not target anyone. I think what the cactus is getting at is maybe we’ve got some dicks running around with swapping powers, where they can make me target someone other than who I actually pick. Which, yeah, that sounds like the kind of thing she’d do, doesn’t it. That’s why I was kind of planning not to tell you who I’m going to target, so the mafia can’t just direct it to whoever they please.”

 

[Dragonfree]

“Of course,” he added, with another exasperated look at Darkwhite, “who knows, maybe there’s somebody who can just redirect my action to somebody, without having to know who I originally targeted, in which case there’s nothing we can do about it without knowing who they are.”

 

[Equitial]

Yup and, so for today, it looks like we're all heading for no-elimination today with like two and a half hours left (I think), so that's that!

[[
Wait nope I got confused. We have 6 and a half hours left.
]]

 

[Equitial]

[[
Going through the players and organizing notes. @Panoramic_Vacuum, you're the only active player I can't tell how you feel about DF. Would you say you trust, sus, or remain neutral on her?
]]

 

[Chibi Pika]

Ajia raised her paw. "Actually, I was hoping to have a discussion on if Dave should announce his dread target. I don't think we should go around planning to get more dread because we already know someone's going to get +2 tonight, and that'll confirm it as a thing anyway. "

She flipped through some of her notes, tail flicking lightly behind her. "Dave mentioned one of the cons himself--that the mafia could swap it onto someone else. But if they do that, that gives us information. Actual confirmed proof they have a swapper! Of course, if that doesn't happen, it doesn't mean they don't have a swapper, because they could just... not do that." She chuckled a bit. "Also, if they swapped someone, the recipient would be informed, and could tell us. Also, I think they would probably be less likely to be mafia?" Her mind was spinning now. More potential strategies, ways to utilize this power in the late game...

"Anytime we can make the mafia choose between going for the optimal move, and giving us information, I think we should go for it."

 

[Blossomleaf]

Ajia raised her paw. "Actually, I was hoping to have a discussion on if Dave should announce his dread target. I don't think we should go around planning to get more dread because we already know someone's going to get +2 tonight, and that'll confirm it as a thing anyway. "

She flipped through some of her notes, tail flicking lightly behind her. "Dave mentioned one of the cons himself--that the mafia could swap it onto someone else. But if they do that, that gives us information. Actual confirmed proof they have a swapper! Of course, if that doesn't happen, it doesn't mean they don't have a swapper, because they could just... not do that." She chuckled a bit. "Also, if they swapped someone, the recipient would be informed, and could tell us. Also, I think they would probably be less likely to be mafia?" Her mind was spinning now. More potential strategies, ways to utilize this power in the late game...

"Anytime we can make the mafia choose between going for the optimal move, and giving us information, I think we should go for it."

"... You know that's actually not a bad idea." Nanu chimed in agreement alongside his Guardian device pinging happily as well. " Because at this point we already know someone is going to get the dread counters regardless. And if we have some willing volunteers... Then we can use that to confirm what Dave is saying and also determine if the mafia will do this" role swap or redirection" like everyone is concerned about." Nanu replied content with Aija's suggestion. To acquire more Intel with what they already have / know.

As the Island Kahuna turned to look over at Dave the Mightyena. To see if @Dragonfree would be on board with this newest plan as well.

 

[Equitial]

BARTHOLOMEW:
-- Kitty has good idea
-- Mightyena should consider

 

[Panoramic_Vacuum]

[[
Going through the players and organizing notes. @Panoramic_Vacuum, you're the only active player I can't tell how you feel about DF. Would you say you trust, sus, or remain neutral on her?
]]

Sidney rubbed a hand down the side of his face and sighed. "Shit, I dunno, man. It's not so straightforward. There's two parts to this. First, is this Dave guy scum or not. And two, this whole Dread powers thing."

He paused a moment, listening.

"Yeah, I'm gonna go neutral on this. We just don't know enough yet. Dread could be a good thing. It can be used to put pressure on the bad guys. Or a bad thing, like takin' out his own team. Question is, who is gonna think it's more dangerous to them: good guys or bad guys?"

"'Sides, if the bad guys are scared, they might just off him in the night anyway."

 

[Panoramic_Vacuum]

"I guess what it comes down to is I believe in these powers for now. That should be pretty obvious by tomorrow whether that's true or not, barring some kind of interference."

"There's a lot of things unaccounted for, though, including one thing Dave chose to keep secret, too."

Sidney raised his hand and began to count, growing long needles as he went. "Three abilities per person, and then there's what, twenty of us? That's a lotta shit that can go wrong. Guess I'm just sayin' we shouldn't be too sure of anything at this point."

The needles that tracked up the length of his forearm shrunk back down and disappeared.

"At least that Dave guy can't accidentally kill anyone tonight? I think?"

 

[Blossomleaf]

"I guess what it comes down to is I believe in these powers for now. That should be pretty obvious by tomorrow whether that's true or not, barring some kind of interference."

"There's a lot of things unaccounted for, though, including one thing Dave chose to keep secret, too."

Sidney raised his hand and began to count, growing long needles as he went. "Three abilities per person, and then there's what, twenty of us? That's a lotta shit that can go wrong. Guess I'm just sayin' we shouldn't be too sure of anything at this point."

The needles that tracked up the length of his forearm shrunk back down and disappeared.

"At least that Dave guy can't accidentally kill anyone tonight? I think?"

"From my understanding the most Dave can do is give someone 2 dread counts to carry over into D2. Which doesn't activate either the power seal or the elimination part of the dread ability." Nanu replied, ruminating everything Sidney was saying. "But you have a point about how three abilities per person is problematic with how large the group is. And come to think of it...We only have confirmation of two out of three of Dave's role right? So we don't have any context for what Dave's third ability is...and that could change everything because we don't know which or the three abilities he left out right? " Nanu consulted the Guardian device for clarification.

[[So the friendly voice was unmuted and could chime in as well. " .. . Aye. That's true although Dragonfree and Dave said that it's something they can't reveal. Nor is it something they think we'd believe? So, for now we just have to work with what we know right now. And it's why I agree that I think Chibi / Ajia plan is our best option. If Dragonfree and Dave agree to go through with it anyway"] ]

 

[windskull]

[[I think it's safe to assume the ability he left out is his oneshot. Miller is a passive modifier and the dread is something he has to do nightly. Though the details of said oneshot ability is to be seen.]]

 

[Bluwiikoon]

"you know, i actually feel like the silly strings is some kind of 'cult leader' thing, rather than gaining control of people," said sans, scratching his chin in thought. "'cause they apparently just want to put the strings on as many people as possible, according to the info dave received."

 

[bruh moment]

[[mewtini catch up halfway through the phase speedrun ... is there anything specific that happened that i should take a look at? would love any and all suggestions B) ]]

 

[bruh moment]

[[i have been informed that it is in fact Significantly more than halfway through the phase.]]