[Town victory] Vanilla Mafia!

[Homestar!]

[[And Wes was still voting for Clovis until I was writing my readlist, you can go check, my read for him says it's a good thing he changed off of tunnelling on Clovis while I was procrastinating. I remember him acting that way because of that occurrence, which... isn't false at all, actually:


It made sense for me to suspect Wes as Espy's teammate for the time, no matter how badly you want to push the idea that me suspecting people other than myself is super scummy.]]

"The scummy part ain't the 'suspecting people'," Mike pointed out. "The scummy part is getting caught in the web of lies.

"Take it from the big, fat, spidery master of getting his God's Gift to Asses caught in a lie: If you fuck up, own it. Let the truth out. It's all anyone can do, at the end of the day." Mike shrugged. He leaned on the feeble, dry twig which gave a gentle groan under his weight.

"To Hazel and their Voice, it made sense to not suspect themself. And for them to suspect someone against them."

"No argument there," Mike shrugged. "It's the way they did it, not what they did."

 

[Shiny Phantump]

[[Wes unvoted Clovis a mere 2 hours and 7 minutes before the deadline, saying he went after them for most of the day isn't a malicious lie, it's provably true. It, of course, doesn't matter, because it obviously meant nothing in the end now that you flipped him, but framing it the way you are is disingenuous. If you're so sure I'm scum, you shouldn't have to misconstrue things to make it look that way.]]

 

[Homestar!]

[[Wes unvoted Clovis a mere 2 hours and 7 minutes before the deadline, saying he went after them for most of the day isn't a malicious lie, it's provably true. It, of course, doesn't matter, because it obviously meant nothing in the end now that you flipped him, but framing it the way you are is disingenuous. If you're so sure I'm scum, you shouldn't have to misconstrue things to make it look that way.]]

[[Quotes-within-quotes is having a hard time, but clicking the first one will bring you right back.

So we're still talking about this:

[[Funny! That's not how I remember it going at all! See these posts trying to throw suspicion at BOTH lover pairs, both taking place after their claims:


In fact, tunneling on Lovers was one of the first reasons I was a little leery of you, which is why I remembered this well enough to bother digging it up.]]

Debunked here:

The last two quotes were before the lover claims. The last one in particular, of my reads, was being typed up WHILE Tetra posted her lovers claim, so I didn’t see it until after I posted and I feel like I made that pretty clear. I changed my reads list after that.

Nice try with pulling my words out of context, though 😉

And yes, I went back to find the posts I made AFTER the lovers claims just to prove I really did say these things at the end of D1:

[[Now this is amusing! Because I only tunneled on the lovers before they made their claims. Kent made an early soft claim, but nobody believed him and was prepared to lynch him anyway because of the suspicious play style. I tunneled on Clovis after Hana’s claim because I was SURE that, at the time, there wouldn’t be two pairs of lovers. The fact that there were two pairs was a surprise to pretty much everyone.

tldr: you couldn’t have become sus of me for tunneling on the lovers because nobody knew they were lovers until after I’d stopped tunneling them.]]

Doubled-down here:

[[Because I was tired of people tunnelling lovers, which she didn't do. This was, for the record, a good idea and you should probably also have done that as well instead of going after both pairs lovers. Jackie and Chibi also felt the same way.

You are conveniently misremebering the order this happened:



(I'm pretty sure Homestar also helped start it before me but I can't find that.)

Tetra was the third one to clam Lovers, after the two you were tunnelling on. Abra claimed Lovers a long time ago and Sind had already countered it.]]

Debunked here again:

[[Just pulling this up as well; Tetra brought up two sets of lovers briefly iirc, but other than Tetra, Free was one of the first to bring up the possibility of two lovers. Which is an interesting assumption to make in a vanilla game!

You just ignored the fact that I said I didn’t know who the lovers were when I was suspicious of Kent. I was also not the only one who continued to be suspicious of Kent after his soft claim.

So you’re saying you didn’t start the vote train. This actually helps my mafia lovers theory then. You didn’t start the vote train but joined it after it started gaining some traction.

Clovis did not claim lovers at that point. He only said he knew who the lovers were, so at that point he could have been, idk, a rolecop or something. He looked incredibly suspicious after Hana’s claim because, again, I wasn’t really considering the possibility of two lover sets at this point on the grounds that this was supposed to be a “vanilla” game. (Lol.)]]

All easily traced and verifiable.]]

 

[Shiny Phantump]

[[Clovis had been seemed like a Lover to me since their soft-counterclaim, so yeah, it bugged me and I remembered it when people went after them anyways.

It shouldn't be a surprise to you that I remembered Wes going after someone he went after untila couple hours before the vote deadline. Ultimately Hello may not have picked up on the softclaims by then, but I had so it stuck out and bugged me when people went after them.

It's a much less scummy mistake than someone forcing lovers to claim D1 in the first place, so I find it super funny that it's you of all people pushing it so hard.]]

 

[Shiny Phantump]

[[Nobody else but you really cares about this minor miscommunication, and continuing to push it is just a distraction from actual helpful discussion.]]

 

[Homestar!]

[[Nobody else but you really cares about this minor miscommunication, and continuing to push it is just a distraction from actual helpful discussion.]]

[[... Like what?

We caught you in a lie. We're voting you out today. Everyone's strained and exhausted.

I mean... We can RP if you like?]]

 

[Shiny Phantump]

[[Even if I was scum, there still wouldn't be an reason for me to ""maliciously lie in a provable way"" like that. It was a small mistake, and if we're voting people out for those, we need to get rid of you ten times over by now. There's no sensible reason for me to try to kill myself like that regardless of alignment.

Now that he is proven innocent (something that, remember, I would have had to actively decide to do to myself as scum) you are driving this as a wedge issue that it just isn't to distract from yourself. Or is blowing smoke in the are not a problem when you do it because your other scummy play exonerates you?]]

 

[Shiny Phantump]

[[Now, to be fair, Homestar has no reason not to be going after me today, but hopefully our teammates can recognize it as weak play.]]

 

[Homestar!]

[[Even if I was scum, there still wouldn't be an reason for me to ""maliciously lie in a provable way"" like that. It was a small mistake, and if we're voting people out for those, we need to get rid of you ten times over by now. There's no sensible reason for me to try to kill myself like that regardless of alignment.

[[I agree. My play was piss-poor. So bad, in fact, that I foresaw this specific day coming and I tried to quit to avoid it. God said, "no." Otherwise you would be out on your ass today and I wouldn't have chest pains.

Now that he is proven innocent (something that, remember, I would have had to actively decide to do to myself as scum) you are driving this as a wedge issue that it just isn't to distract from yourself. Or is blowing smoke in the are not a problem when you do it because your other scummy play exonerates you?]]

You started this today. Right here:

[[Then, you angled up the idea that it must be scummy of me to suspect that any of the two remaining Mafia players other than me might have been Wes, before flipping him tonight.]]

 

[Shiny Phantump]

"Either Espy and Phan are both scum and nonsensically attacking one another,

"Or we have severely underestimated Wes."

[[You have even yourself inadvertently admitted that, (given I know I'm not scum,) it only makes sense for me to go after Wes back when it used to be convenient for you. Me thinking Wes was a sensible suspicion for me to have was an obvious observation to make and had nothing to do with me being annoyed yesterday. Don't turn back on that now that Wes' death gives you a convenient angle to push.]]

 

[Homestar!]

[[You have even yourself inadvertently admitted that, (given I know I'm not scum,) it only makes sense for me to go after Wes back when it used to be convenient for you. Me thinking Wes was a sensible suspicion for me to have was an obvious observation to make and had nothing to do with me being annoyed yesterday. Don't turn back on that now that Wes' death gives you a convenient angle to push.]]

[[Would you like to dig up my follow-ups to that post, or shall I?]]

 

[Homestar!]

[[You have even yourself inadvertently admitted that, (given I know I'm not scum,) it only makes sense for me to go after Wes back when it used to be convenient for you. Me thinking Wes was a sensible suspicion for me to have was an obvious observation to make and had nothing to do with me being annoyed yesterday. Don't turn back on that now that Wes' death gives you a convenient angle to push.]]

[[The bolded sentence: can you rephrase it? That's really hard for my ricotta brain to parse right now.

If it says what I think it says:
I absolutely agree that Wes was your only viable option to push, to the point where I even entertained the idea of Mafia!Wes for a few posts. And I feel the strong implication here is that I, at some point, said you were in the wrong for doing so. And if I did prior (which I don't think I did?), then I'll say now that you, as the Mafia, made the correct move. Lovers were too dangerous, Reme was hard confirmed, I was medium-confirmed. The only place to point a finger that didn't sound absolutely ludicrous (it sounded, dare I say, plausible) was Wes.]]

 

[Homestar!]

And I feel the strong implication here is that I, at some point, said you were in the wrong for doing so.

[[To be completely transparent:

I think that you pushing for Wes was both your downfall and your only move. The play was not 'incorrect.']]

 

[Homestar!]

[[I see how that was confusing when I first replied. To be fair, it's a finicky distinction to make.]]

 

[Persephone]

[[Holy crap I’m still around. I think that means we have one mafia left. Two they would’ve gone to even things up. And going for Phan. Homestar! Just strikes me as being new at all this.]]

 

[Fusion]

"I never would have thought that an argument between two Voices that shouldn't exist would be entertaining," Reme said, sitting on a stump and crossing her legs. "This feels like a stretch to call entertaining, but no other descriptor really fits."

 

[Persephone]

[[Also voting to end early because what else is there to do now, really?]]

 

[Homestar!]

"I never would have thought that an argument between two Voices that shouldn't exist would be entertaining," Reme said, sitting on a stump and crossing her legs. "This feels like a stretch to call entertaining, but no other descriptor really fits."

"'Enthralling' might be a good one," Mike pointed out. "Maybe 'diverting' or 'fascinating.' Possibly 'provocative' or--

"Sorry," he muttered. "English teacher. Or, uh, almost."

 

[Fusion]

Reme chuckled lightly, shaking her head. "An English Teacher and a Trainer? If I heard about that before we actually met, I'd have still been reeling from your gambit on the first day."

 

[Homestar!]

Reme chuckled lightly, shaking her head. "An English Teacher and a Trainer? If I heard about that before we actually met, I'd have still been reeling from your gambit on the first day."

"In my defense," Mike retorted, "that woulda worked on second-graders." He shimmered his shoulders in a very self-satisfied fashion.