[INNOCENTS WIN] First Anniversary Fanfic Mafia - Game Thread

[NonAnalogue]

-- Conversation initiated with WitchesBlue [FORTUNATA, FIAMETTA] --

[WB] i had a really bad feelin in my gut about desper ado yesterday
[WB] and admittedly the reasonin wasnt that great
[WB] i think i might have been overthinking it
[WB] but everything that came after is kinda makin me feel
[WB] worse
[WB] like
[WB] theres the tryin to claim a night action during the day thing
[WB] and theres the refusin to say who he saved today thing
[WB] and theres the throwin suspicion on a buncha other people as soon as hes suspected thing
[WB] which
[WB] irony duly noted
[WB] but like
[WB] im pretty sure lauchzelot is innocent
[WB] yeah im on lauchzelots shit list
[WB] but even so
[WB] thats how the game goes
[WB] and im not really on the lauchzelot is secretly a mafia targeted by their own teammates boat
[WB] so
[WB] yeah

 

[elyvorg]

[[Tefiren sighed huffily. "No. Never mind. It doesn't matter anyway. I'm bored of waiting for things to get interesting again. Everything was supposed to happen in a more exciting way than this, and then it didn't. But still."

He pointed a wing towards his target, not even bothering to look in her direction. "That white-coat Human"]] (Finnar) [["is one of Them. I'm sure of it."]]

 

[Sike Saner]

My main point here being I don't see any harm in having Espeon tell us now, since there's no-one else left to announce their actions anyway.

Well, technically, I still haven't announced my action beyond stating I didn't protect Starlight Aurate (but did consider it). I should probably mention who I did defend. That'd be Diyem.

My reasoning was that if Namo's telling the truth, then maybe I ought to make sure he survived last night (which was an even night, meaning he couldn't use his action if he's being honest about being odd-night) so that he could maybe get a beneficial vig kill off tonight. In retrospect, I'm not sure that was the right thing to do when I had two other people whom I had stronger town reads on aksjdhsf...

 

[DawningWinds]

Vote: DawningWinds
I'll change my vote if I scumread someone later in the day.

 

[Sike Saner]

[[Tefiren sighed huffily. "No. Never mind. It doesn't matter anyway. I'm bored of waiting for things to get interesting again. Everything was supposed to happen in a more exciting way than this, and then it didn't. But still."

He pointed a wing towards his target, not even bothering to look in her direction. "That white-coat Human"]] (Finnar) [["is one of Them. I'm sure of it."]]

(bolding removed to avoid the risk of that vote being read twice)

DawningWinds is actually on my maybe-innocent list on account of having been targeted by Persephone. I'd like to know the reasoning behind your certainty that Finnar's scum, just in case there's a very good reason why the professor shouldn't be on my town short-list.

 

[Tanuki]

ok a lot of words have occured gimme a second to catch up

 

[Namohysip]

I should probably mention who I did defend. That'd be Diyem.

[[

Diyem hesitated, glancing at Ntairow. This feeling... He shook his head. Unimportant. People didn't 'care' for him--they were just trying to survive. That was how it worked. For all he knew, she was lying. And then what? He'd be betrayed all over again.

He sighed and kept a mental note about this move, in case it was somehow true.

"I want to introduce one other possibility," Diyem said slowly. "I'm not very comofrtable with it... But is there a chance the mafia may also have a backup role? Dual backups? Or perhaps..."

]]

I don't personally know if I have any ground to stand here, but as I mentioned on day 1, I had been mistaken that the backup could become either town or mafia--they don't hop roles. However, they can start off as a mafia backup, too. Could we both have backups, or... I dunno. I genuinely do not understand Tanuki's game. I'll wait for him to explain himself because it looks like he's in the process of catching up.

 

[kyeugh]

i have time to actually sit down and type out my thoughts now, so i'm gonna do a bit of sorting real quick. wallpost incoming. here's the final vote from yesterDay:

5 Persephone - Dragonfree, qva, elyvorg, DawningWinds, Starlight Aurate
4 DawningWinds - windskull, Namohysip, Tanuki, Persephone
1 Abstain - Sike Saner
1 Desper - NonAnalogue
1 Namohysip - Equitia

Not Voting: SparklingEspeon

given how close the final vote was, i think it's pretty much impossible that there was more than one wolf on the persephone wagon. to be honest, i don't find it particularly unlikely that there are no wolves on the persephone wagon, and think this might even probably be the case. starlight aurate and (from my pov) myself are definitely not scum, so if there's a wolf on the persephone wagon, it's one of dragonfree, elyvorg, and dawningwinds. let me talk about each of them:

Spoiler: persephone wagon reads

• dragonfree. i just really don't think dragonfree is scum. i'm mostly drawing on my meta knowledge here from having played other games with her, and read games she participated in that i wasn't a part of. i said this once before, but generally, i tend to agree with dragonfree most of the time in games where we're both town, and disagree in games where i'm town and she's scum. i'm agreeing with her almost exclusively in this game, so that gives me a good feeling about her. dragonfree's insights always appear deep and genuine, so i'm not really basing my read on her on that, and would discourage others from doing so, either—but my vibes for her are good overall, and her vote on persephone is a plus, so i'm content to say she's innocent for now.
• elyvorg. i don't really know elyvorg or her meta, so all i have to go on here is her behavior in this game, but i get very good feelings personally. in my opinion, she's among the more useful townies in this game, with good insights and analysis that raise points that might have otherwise gone unnoticed. if she's scum, my hat's truly off to her for managing to appear so perceptive. her vote for persephone was good as well, and i'll admit i'm ever so slightly pocketed by her early willingness to go around with my plan of shooting into my null pile. content putting her in my innocent pile for now, too.
• dawningwinds. i'll admit most of the theorizing around the sike/dw/espy business somewhat evades me, so i don't feel qualified to speak too strongly about their alignment here. their vote on persephone was also, as far as i'm concerned, pretty much self-preserving. of the people on this wagon, they're probably the one i feel the least strongly about either way. their claim seems fine, especially as no one counter-claimed it, but also seems easy enough to fake as scum. i'll say they're firmly in my null pile for now, although their self-votes improve my opinion somewhat. could be powerwolfing, though.

i don't strongly feel that any of the above players are scum, obviously, so i think there are probably two—maybe, maybe just one, but that seems so unlikely to me that i'm not going to give it the time of day for now. for all intents and purposes, the remaining mafia are some pair in windskull, namo, tanuki, sike, nonanalogue, equitia, and sparklingespeon. i'll give some reads on each of them here, too:

Spoiler: non-persephone wagon reads

• windskull. i honestly can't seem to get a read in one way or the other here, which is part of what inspired my initial vote on them yesterday—oftentimes, when it seems impossible to read someone, it's because they're cleverly flying under the radar. despite that, i tend to nod along whenever they post recently. something about their logic just feels good and genuine. that's an extremely weak lead, but for the sake of rooting through all the players, i'm tentatively placing them in my innocent pile. i could easily be persuaded either way, i think.
• namo. namo's reaction to my push on him the other day was weird, but i don't think unbelievably weird, and my only other real read on him came from the espeon thing, which was in the end pretty much nothing. i don't see any real reason to doubt his roleclaim, honestly, and i think most of the things he's said are very much believable coming from a townie. i've looked quite a lot at his posts because of my scumread on him yesterday, but in the end i feel pretty much ok, and that's after all that scrutiny. so i'm fine putting him in my innocent pile for now as well.
• tanuki. i've given my thoughts at length about him in my last post, so please give it a look, but in the end my feelings are mixed. i don't see any reason to doubt his claim, so that's a huge point in his favor—probably the main thing not stopping me from blatantly scumreading him. his play also seems a bit too boldly obstructive to actually be coming from scum, unless he's just powerwolfing balls to the wall. all things considered, i just don't know... i'm putting him in my null pile, but honestly it's more accurately "ambivalent," since i see very strong reasons to read him either way.
• sike. honestly, not much to say her. i believe her claim, i believe she was probably roleblocked, and i believe that she's genuinely somewhat disengaged town who's just trying to figure out the right thing to do and doesn't particularly care if people decide to axe her. overall i feel fine placing her as innocent.
• nonanalogue. pretty much the only thing i've really noticed about nonanalogue is her tunnel on tanuki, which... i guess my feelings about that are tied to tanuki's alignment. if he's town it's kind of a bad look for nonanalogue, but also not really, because i can't really blame anyone for scumreading tanuki. if he's mafia, that pretty much clears nonanalogue instantly in my book, unless it's just longcon, galaxy brain distancing. i just don't really know what to make of her as-is, though, so i'm putting her as null for now.
• equitia. not strong feelings here, but their posts feel pretty well put-together and thought-out to me, so i really want to townlean them just for that. however, they did vote for dw, and it seems to me like equitia is a somewhat experienced mafia player, which means they're well-equipped to pull the wool over our eyes if they are scum after all. overall i have mixed feelings, none of them particularly strong, so they go in the null pile.
• sparklingespeon. not a ton to really go on here, but i'm inclined to believe their infodump/dropout was genuine, particularly with the added context of the discord chat. there's a possibility it was actually guided by scum and the information was all bogus, but meh, there's not really much reason for me to believe that over not, so i'm not going to entertain it for the time being.

so... now that i've got it all written out, i guess i don't really scumread anyone right now per se—everyone is null at worst. as far as who the best lynch is, barring more revelations... well, i didn't think it was going this way before writing this post up, but i just don't know what to make of tanuki (yes this is a vote), and his flip would help me sort nonanalogue as well, so as far as i'm concerned i think he's the best lynch for now. not really married to this, so if you disagree please feel free to argue me on it because i'm very open to suggestion here, but my view is that pretty much the only way we're going to reliably discern tanuki's alignment at this point is to see his flip when he's lynched/killed, and it would give us some insight into nonanalogue as well, so this is the way to go.

 

[kyeugh]

He pointed a wing towards his target, not even bothering to look in her direction. "That white-coat Human"]] (Finnar) [["is one of Them. I'm sure of it."

is this certainty an in-character thing, or

 

[DawningWinds]

could be powerwolfing, though.

This is my fifth game and I've never been Mafia.

 

[kyeugh]

This is my fifth game and I've never been Mafia.

good to know, although in this case "powerwolfing" refers to a proactive strategy of basically playing scum in a bold, confident manner that doesn't shy away from attention—definitely possible to employ even if it's your first time rolling mafia.

[[

Diyem hesitated, glancing at Ntairow. This feeling... He shook his head. Unimportant. People didn't 'care' for him--they were just trying to survive. That was how it worked. For all he knew, she was lying. And then what? He'd be betrayed all over again.

He sighed and kept a mental note about this move, in case it was somehow true.

"I want to introduce one other possibility," Diyem said slowly. "I'm not very comofrtable with it... But is there a chance the mafia may also have a backup role? Dual backups? Or perhaps..."

]]

I don't personally know if I have any ground to stand here, but as I mentioned on day 1, I had been mistaken that the backup could become either town or mafia--they don't hop roles. However, they can start off as a mafia backup, too. Could we both have backups, or... I dunno. I genuinely do not understand Tanuki's game. I'll wait for him to explain himself because it looks like he's in the process of catching up.

i didn't even consider the possibility of a mafia-aligned backup, but the potential makes me a bit more comfortable about my vote. hmmmm.

 

[elyvorg]

is this certainty an in-character thing, or

Only very slightly. Tefiren is a bit more sure than I am, but I am still pretty damn sure.

Vote: DawningWinds
I'll change my vote if I scumread someone later in the day.

[[Tefiren's gaze snapped towards the white-coat Human as she spoke up for only those few words. "That's it? That's all you're saying? No asking what my reasons are? No trying to tell me I'm wrong? Just 'oh, I don't mind if you get rid of me, because I'm definitely not one of Them anyway!'? That's not what someone who's not one of Them would say!"

He turned his body completely and began to stalk towards her. "If you really weren't one of Them, you wouldn't want us to get rid of you! You'd want us to get rid of someone who at least might be one of Them! Getting rid of yourself when you know you're not Them is stupid! So the only reason you're doing this is that you're trying to make it look like you don't mind if we get rid of you. You're trying to make it look like it makes sense for you to want us to get rid of you. Just like when you did that yesterday evening, hm?"

Now right up close to the Human, Tefiren crept around her in a slow circle, his wing leaves flared out. "Remember yesterday evening? Right near the end, when there were only two people we were ever going to end up getting rid of? This Human, and the yellow-haired one? What if both were Them? Hm? Which one would They want us to get rid of? The one we were picking at random, or the one we were already suspicious of? If we got rid of the one we were suspicious of, the other one would get away with it without looking bad at all, right? We were only picking her at random!"

He poked a claw at the Human's white coat. "That's the only reason someone would ever do something so stupid as wanting to get rid of themselves. And that's also why it doesn't mean anything that the yellow-haired Human who was one of Them also wanted to get rid of this Human here."

He started bouncing eagerly on his foot claws. "And then, and then, I bet what happened next is this. I bet They were having a little whisper between Themselves in the back of all our arguing. Something like..." Tefiren put on a mock-Them voice, making sure he made it sound as stupid as They were. "'Oh no, why are you doing something so stupid? If they get rid of you and find out you're one of Them, they're going to realise you got rid of yourself to protect me because I'm one of Them, too! They'll know it was me anyway! Change it back! Get rid of me instead, that's just a little bit less stupid!' So this Human did that, even though it decided her buddy's fate. Because her stupidity had already made sure we'd be super-suspicious of the yellow-haired Human today anyway, even though we were picking at random last night. But this way, we'd go back to only being a little bit suspicious of white-coat here today."

Tefiren giggled right in the Human's face. "But it didn't work on me! I figured it out! I saw right through your measly little trick. Nobody can trick me, and especially not Them."

He turned back to the rest of the group, grinning, feeling like things were already getting a lot more interesting now. "That's not the only reason I'm sure she's one of Them. Do you want to hear the others? Do you? Do you?"

]]

(I am willing to provide an OOC translation of any of this if the way Tefiren's putting things isn't clear enough.)

 

[DawningWinds]

good to know, although in this case "powerwolfing" refers to a proactive strategy of basically playing scum in a bold, confident manner that doesn't shy away from attention—definitely possible to employ even if it's your first time rolling mafia.

Okay maybe I would do something like that. (Basically for those who don't want to click the link I straight up went against what the host said in the literal first post of the game as Serial Killer and a bunch of people townread me because a Mafia genius said that it didn't seem like a scum move for me + most players had never played with me before.)

Anyway reads:
qva - Very actively helping town, basically confirmed town by my night 1 action
elyvorg - Seems to be putting great effort into finding Mafia
Sike Saner - Claim is believable, though somewhat counterclaimed by Tanuki. Looks to be helping town
dragonfree - Seems to be looking for Mafia to some extent.
windskull
nonAnalogue
Equitia - Can't form much of a read on any of them
Tanuki - Doesn't honestly look like he's done much to help town
DawningWinds - Could easily be a Mafia Bus Driver, has mostly avoided RPing and when doing so has avoided showing their character's thoughts (possibly to prevent having to RP lie), admits to being a person who might powerwolf and linked an example of them pretty much doing exactly that. Vote on Peresphone seems somewhat self-preservation-y, though reasoning is explained. Makes little effort to defend themself. (This is not me admitting to being scum because I'm not, but yeah I see plenty of reasons to lynch myself.)

 

[Namohysip]

[[

The eagerness of the winged Grovyle unnerved Diyem, but the words themselves had... some sense. "What you're saying," Diyem said, "is that Finnar's self-vote is an act of reverse psychology?"

...He wondered if this creature knew what reverse-psychology was.

]]

 

[DawningWinds]

DawningWinds - Could easily be a Mafia Bus Driver, has mostly avoided RPing and when doing so has avoided showing their character's thoughts (possibly to prevent having to RP lie), admits to being a person who might powerwolf and linked an example of them pretty much doing exactly that. Vote on Peresphone seems somewhat self-preservation-y, though reasoning is explained. Makes little effort to defend themself. (This is not me admitting to being scum because I'm not, but yeah I see plenty of reasons to lynch myself.)

+ Was seen by Watcher who targeted the person who died


No, elyvorg, I'm not going to ask what you're reasons are because I see plenty of them. And to be honest, I don't have much of a defense against any of them besides my explanation of my vote on Persephone.

 

[Sike Saner]

@DawningWinds Come to think of it, why do you keep nominating yourself?

 

[Dragonfree]

I switched qva and windskull.

All results involving either of these two should probably consider this switch.

Why did you switch the two of them? qva had indicated healers should not heal her; this switch would have the potential to direct healers towards her, or conveniently ensure there'd be no healers on Windskull.

-- Conversation initiated with WitchesBlue [FORTUNATA, FIAMETTA] --

[WB] what happened yall
[WB] yalls reactions are sayin something really weird just happened
[WB] im guessin the mafia got that bakura guy
[WB] but what happened
[WB] did he
[WB] like
[WB] explode or something
[WB] cmon yall help me out here

[[Dave blinked hard at where the unholy abomination had disappeared.

"...Let's be clear here, that was not a dragon, it was a giant muscular demon with a dragon for a dick."

Dave felt he had learned entirely too much about the board game gods' sexual tastes, but then again, being a goddamn pervert was pretty par for the course for deities, wasn't it, considering just about every fucking mythology ever invented.]]

Okay, so. I didn't defend Yami Bakura last night (though he was on my shortlist at that point--more on that shortly). So I can't say I was definitely roleblocked this time.

I still could have been, however. If Yami Bakura was switched with the person I was defending, my protection would've landed on Yami Bakura, but the roleblocker would've nullified it in this case, allowing the mafia to take him out. And if nobody switched my target with anyone else, or my target was switched with someone other than Yami Bakura, the effect would've been the same as if nobody roleblocked me.

[["The fuck are you talking about? If you weren't protecting him, there's no reason to think you were blocked and no reason to even discuss it."]]

For the important bit, I still say we gun for DawningWinds because, while lucky, it's not impossible or all that unlikely that they blocked Sike and I'd rather lose a switcher than a protector.

Finally, I have one last, very crazy theory. In the craze of last night, we had two people who we were discussing lynching because they were both very implicated in a crime and would've given us tons of info. Then, y'all decided to shoot in the dark and hit Persephone. We got a mafia, which is good. Elyv, I believe, told qva to pick someone somewhat suspicious because she was the least suspicious out of all of us.

[["Hey, asshole, I voted for Genesis first. Why's the fucking bird getting the credit? And also I didn't fucking pick her at random.]]

First, it is important to note that one of the reasons we all assume qva is innocent is because the switch shenanigans made her so. Those switch shenanigans are in question now, though.

I'm sorry, I think I missed what new info we learned that called the switching into question?

I'm confused why qva is placing Sike and DW in the "Good" pile after what happened last night, especially after putting Espeon in the good pile shortly after. Even though there's a chance that Sike was roleblocked (and going over my notes, her behavior is consistent with this so far) Dawning Winds in particular still doesn't seem cleared to me.

DawningWinds isn't cleared but their story is perfectly consistent with what happened? Again, unless I missed something. That said, of course...

He pointed a wing towards his target, not even bothering to look in her direction. "That white-coat Human"]] (Finnar) [["is one of Them. I'm sure of it."

...

He turned back to the rest of the group, grinning, feeling like things were already getting a lot more interesting now. "That's not the only reason I'm sure she's one of Them. Do you want to hear the others? Do you? Do you?" ]]

[[Dave folded his arms. "Yeah, I'd like to hear what else is making you so fucking sure, besides your post-hoc narrative-building."]]

I don't personally know if I have any ground to stand here, but as I mentioned on day 1, I had been mistaken that the backup could become either town or mafia--they don't hop roles. However, they can start off as a mafia backup, too. Could we both have backups, or... I dunno. I genuinely do not understand Tanuki's game. I'll wait for him to explain himself because it looks like he's in the process of catching up.

[["I mean, if he's a member of the mafia why the fuck would we believe he's a backup in the first fucking place? That doesn't make any fucking sense."]]

 

[kyeugh]

He turned back to the rest of the group, grinning, feeling like things were already getting a lot more interesting now. "That's not the only reason I'm sure she's one of Them. Do you want to hear the others? Do you? Do you?"

[[ Lauchselot clapped his wings in delight. “Yes, do go on!” ]]

 

[kyeugh]

[["Hey, asshole, I voted for Genesis first. Why's the fucking bird getting the credit? And also I didn't fucking pick her at random.]]

hahahaha omg good point

 

[elyvorg]

[[

The eagerness of the winged Grovyle unnerved Diyem, but the words themselves had... some sense. "What you're saying," Diyem said, "is that Finnar's self-vote is an act of reverse psychology?"

...He wondered if this creature knew what reverse-psychology was.

]]

(no, he does not know that term, geez let me try and wrangle this into Tefirenlogic somehow)

[["Reverse-what?" He shook his head. "It doesn't matter. Last night, she was trying to protect her more-innocent-looking Them buddy. Today, she's trying to make it look like it makes sense for someone who isn't one of Them to want to get rid of themselves. But it doesn't! If I said I wanted to get rid of you, fiery one, would you agree with me? Would you agree with me even if your tricks weren't useful at all, and if we'd learn something from getting rid of you? No! Of course you wouldn't! Because you'd know you're not one of Them! The whole point of this game is to get rid of Them, not waste time getting rid of people we know aren't!"
]]

(...man, all this mafia-playing has got Tefiren to somewhat sort of figure out how to put himself in other people's shoes, that's impressive.)