[INNOCENTS WIN] First Anniversary Fanfic Mafia - Game Thread

[windskull]

[["No. Humans do not evolve. And based on my analysis, we would definitely not qualify as dragon-types. We don't have elemental powers or anything, but I've seen humans get blasted with Shadow Ball and it clearly hurt, so I'd say we're most like fighting-types. In reality, though, humans can't be given a type no matter how you put it."]
[[
Humans don't evolve? Nor do they have a type? Then how useful were they? Running around noisily and clumsily like a beartic with no care for danger... maybe that was why they were dangerous. Despite being typeless, they were so powerful that it made them belive they were the most powerful beings around. That was cute, but they lacked the stealth that made him stronger.

[[

"He's a demon possessing a human body," Diyem said casually, waving it off. "Happens all the time. Unimportant. Not the same kind of demon we're dealing with here. Let the world he came from handle the apocalypse he's trying to cause; it's irrelevant to us."

]]

Nip failed to see how this was something that "happened all the time," as Diyem put it, but he was willing to move on to more important things, such as...]]

Tefiren turned to the fiery one. "You think that Human had tricks that could sniff out Them, and They knew about it? Huh."

He thought for a moment. "But if They knew... and They didn't use any special tricks to figure it out, because there's no way They're clever enough to do that... what if They thought one of our protectors knew, too? Maybe this at least means They just used up Their trick that can catch anyone no matter what."

That's definitely a possibility, but I think we should also keep in mind the possibility of a well-aimed roleblock - oh, Sike just posted hold on...
Ok, roleblock probably did not affect things in this case unless Tanuki

I think both Namo and qva make good points as well. Based on Negrek's list of possible roles, there are currently three inforoles unaccounted for (if I understand the definition of inforole correctly): tracker, cop, and oracle. Assuming all four are in the game, even if we were to assume that everyone that has not claimed a role is town, if the mafia aimed at someone in that pile, they had a 3/7 chance of hitting someone with an inforole. But it's statistically unlikely that everyone in the mafia has claimed a role, making those chances higher.

 

[windskull]

oop I forgot to finish my edited thought and apparently messed up my bbc code Anyways, what I was saying is if Tanuki was protecting starlight a well-aimed roleblock could have worked as well.

 

[Tanuki]

if Tanuki was protecting starlight

I'm gonna not say who I was protecting for the sake of giving the mafia as little info as possible.

 

[elyvorg]

I'm gonna not say who I was protecting for the sake of giving the mafia as little info as possible.

[["If it was the white-haired Human, that matters, because that means They definitely used Their special power to catch anyone no matter what. Or stopped you, maybe. You should at least tell us whether or not it was him."
]]

I... can't think of a reason why it would give any meaningful amount of information to the mafia to tell us who you protected last night. (Probably wouldn't give any meaningful information to us either, but still.) Unless you're actually a seraph knight, aka a doctor who can't switch their target, in which case yes, do stay quiet.

 

[kyeugh]

i can’t tell if you’re seriously making the argument that i’m scum and moved the lynch away from what was rapidly becoming a consensus only so i could kill my teammate
the lynch didn’t “just happen” to land on scum randomly, it was a choice and in no world do i, as scum, mobilize town against the momentum of the thread to kill my scumbuddy

 

[Namohysip]

I'm confused why qva is placing Sike and DW in the "Good" pile after what happened last night, especially after putting Espeon in the good pile shortly after. Even though there's a chance that Sike was roleblocked (and going over my notes, her behavior is consistent with this so far) Dawning Winds in particular still doesn't seem cleared to me.

[[

"I spent the night poring over everything that had transpired," Diyem said. "Unfortunately, most of this is from my own biased perspective, the assumption that I am innocent. But with Genesis proven to be mafia, I want to outline everything that happened last night from that context. First..." He turned around, motioning vaguely to the group as a whole. "How this bandwagoning against everyone started.

"Genesis was one of the first to raise the idea that I was suspicious, if not the first, last night. However, she did not actually voice her actual vote to get rid of me until others fell in line, and then cast her vote against me. Lauchs, meanwhile, perhaps due to his... aggressive style of play, followed after and was generally quick to accuse several individuals. Is also quick to unvote, and was rather quick to unvote for me in particular... Which I do not think a mafia would be willing to do. So, for that reason..."

Diyem growled and tried what he could to keep himself dignified. He faced Lauchs. "I would like to apologize for my hostility toward you. While you are aggressive, so am I. At the moment, I do not consider you to be mafia... And should I be wrong, I will find everything in my power to destroy you and then myself." That would do.

Back to more important matters, he looked back at the team. "Dave contributed strongly to the bandwagon against Genesis out of nearly nowhere. For that reason, I have reason to suspect Dave is innocent until we find some proof otherwise."

"Finnar was my main suspect yesterday. Finnar was quick to vote against Sike after voting for me in the badnwagon. All things considered, I do not know what to think. Being the mafia bus driver is still possible. Unfortunately... I have no proof of this beyond the simple, strange choice to switch Lauchs and Chibi for the night Chibi was taken, such that Espurr was unable to see who actually performed the kill. It was too perfect."

Then, Diyem turned to Desper. "...I don't really know what to think about you. You are all over the place. The fact that you have a projectile weapon at all is a cause for concern. ...But I do find it strange that you said 'all three' mafia yesterday. You pointed it out yourself. Still... considering how scattered you are, I don't know how much weight I should put on that."

He vaguely motioned to Lauchs. "He did the same, implicitly, saying 'maybe we could win instantly' with three town shots. Three. Such an odd number. But I also wonder if three is the actual number. How many of us were there? 14? Three of fourteen. Is this a standard number for these games? You appear more well-versed in these, so I wonder if that is true. For Desper, I have my doubts."

He then looked at the phone that contained Fortunata. "...I have almost no information on you."

Then, to Ntairow. "...You were once among my most suspicious. But after thinking over your behavior, I'm still conflicted. First, my horribly misguided alphabet-swap proposal. You agreed to it near-instantly. Was it for the same reason as me, not knowing that it would be detrimental with a roleblocker present? ...Additionally, Genesis, upon losing her vote against me, went for you instead. That would be either to throw another mafia under the bus to look good, or you genuinely are a doctor. Voting against you... is a risk I'm no longer willing to take, for now."

Then, to Nip. "...Similar to the phone... I do not have a lot to say for you one way or the other. Unknowns are beginning to worry me. I appreciate that you are trying to speak up more now."

Next, Jen. "...Similar to Lauchs, I'm sensing a target on my back from you, and I'm not sure why. You typically agree with others with a bandwagon or otherwise throw suspicion onto me."

Then, Espurr, but he just shook his head. As far as he was concerned, she seemed innocent and inexperienced. For a Psychic, she seemed easy to read.

Finally, Tefiren. "...Your efforts are some of the most genuine to try to help the town. You were quick to unvote when you sensed doubt about someone being mafia or innocent. All things considered, I do not consider you suspicious."

]]

tl;dr: I looked through all that happened and tried to log down what stood out to me from my perspective. Persephone was quick to raise suspicions about me and then eventually cast a vote at the opportune time when the bandwagon started rolling. She played me for Diyem's aggressive counters, and got a lot of innocents to fall for it. Now that we know she's mafia, I hope this colors that entire exchange in an entirely different light.

That also means her second vote toward Sike when the bandwagon against me failed makes Sike seem more innocent in my eyes. I'm not sure if they want to willingly get rid of their own so early in the game, but it's a possible play. Still, I'm not comfortable voting against Sike until more information comes. I'm treating her as innocent.

I can't say the same for Dawning Winds just yet. Also voted against Sike very quickly, but it could have been for basic logic, but a lot of their votes lined up with Persephone. Correct me if I'm wrong; my perspective might be biased there. But a mafia bus driver is still a possibility, which would potentially explain the coordinated assault against Chibi.

Also, Tanuki, pretty sure that ring's lore makes people evil. Careful with that thing.

--

I got ninja'd by a ton of posts, gonna catch up.

 

[kyeugh]

Persephone was quick to raise suspicions about me and then eventually cast a vote at the opportune time when the bandwagon started rolling.

hm valid point, i think this is a good look for you

 

[kyeugh]

I'm confused why qva is placing Sike and DW in the "Good" pile after what happened last night, especially after putting Espeon in the good pile shortly after. Even though there's a chance that Sike was roleblocked (and going over my notes, her behavior is consistent with this so far) Dawning Winds in particular still doesn't seem cleared to me.

i just think they’re all telling the truth, and that sike was roleblocked. that’s why i didn’t want to vote for any of them and asked people to vote one of the nulls instead

 

[kyeugh]

He vaguely motioned to Lauchs. "He did the same, implicitly, saying 'maybe we could win instantly' with three town shots. Three. Such an odd number. But I also wonder if three is the actual number. How many of us were there? 14? Three of fourteen. Is this a standard number for these games? You appear more well-versed in these, so I wonder if that is true. For Desper, I have my doubts."

[[ Lauchs nodded sharply. “Yes, three is the number I’m working with, but it’s nothing more than an assumption. It was the number I used in my calculations on our first day, as well. I will observe that when Ser Desper made the same assumption, he openly characterized it as something that might appear to have been a perspective slip. Something to keep in mind, though perhaps the brazenness of his statement is exactly what renders it inert...” ]]

 

[Sike Saner]

Then, to Ntairow. "...You were once among my most suspicious. But after thinking over your behavior, I'm still conflicted. First, my horribly misguided alphabet-swap proposal. You agreed to it near-instantly. Was it for the same reason as me, not knowing that it would be detrimental with a roleblocker present? ...Additionally, Genesis, upon losing her vote against me, went for you instead. That would be either to throw another mafia under the bus to look good, or you genuinely are a doctor. Voting against you... is a risk I'm no longer willing to take, for now."]]

[[If Ntairow weren't still a little shaken by what she'd seen and what she'd determined in its wake, she might have scoffed, if gently. "I don't recall agreeing to anything," she said. "But I will admit, I was considering doing so. And... no," she said shamefully, "I didn't see the flaw in the plan as quickly as I should have. Once I did... I'm sorry, Diyem. I thought that you were trying to sabotage my efforts. That's why I initially voted for you."
]]

Indeed, she actually never did voice her support for it, though she had silently thought well of it, as mentioned here:

[[Ntairow gave Diyem a long, silent look. Then she bowed her head.

"I thought well of you," she said. "I would still like to, but..." The more she'd thought about the plan to restrict her capacity to defend others based on their names, the less she'd liked it. When it all came down to it, it was just another person getting in her way, potentially sabotaging her capacity to protect.

I'm the one who agreed to it pretty darn quick, as shown in this post (linked and not quoted so as to keep the post i quoted therein intact).

That said, I don't see the mixup as cause for suspicion against you. Only reason I'm bringing it up is to emphasize the importance of keeping track of which statements are RP and which are OOC.

 

[Tanuki]

i can’t tell if you’re seriously making the argument that i’m scum and moved the lynch away from what was rapidly becoming a consensus only so i could kill my teammate

[[Desper shrugged his shoulders. "You'd be s'prised how many times I been shot at by my own once the sheriff shows." A wall with his name, mug, and 2000 appeared for him t'lean up against. He flipped out his iron'n tapped it 'gainst the bounty. "Lot to be gained from turnin' in one'yer own. Makes you look clean's gold'n a vault. Small hit fer a big heist'n all."

He flipped his iron back'nto its holster 'n' gestured t'wards the Switchers Three. "Told y'it was a gambit. Killin' makes y'crazy, though." He smiled'n reached for the bottle 'e'd just conjured while his free paw pulled the brim of his hat o'er his eyes. "Wouldn't put t'much thought'nto that three business, persn'lly. Errythin's threes. Cr'ation dragons, Reshi'n'all them, 's an easy number to jump to. A'course," he pulled his brim up just enough to raise a brow t'wards Diyem. "Nuttin' more damnin' than'gnorin' evidence 'gainst ya."]]

OOC/Translation: Yeah, I know it's an insane theory, but I just think it's a possibility. That whole event made three people look very innocent. Now that it's in question, who it made look innocent should be under suspicion. Killing Persephone makes you look impossibly innocent... and thus suspicious.

As for the threes thing, yeah, it's just a common number. States of matter, monitors, stages of chu-evolution, it's just an easy number to cross someone's mind. I wouldn't put much thought behind it. Of course, I would say that, given it's suspicion against me, but I feel like that could be said of anything anyone's saying here.

 

[elyvorg]

[[Tefiren huffed, still put out by this morning's rude awakening. Spectacular displays of drama like that were only supposed to come from people who were winning, not from someone who was about to lose.]]

(Tefiren, when will you get the memo that dead innocents don't instantly lose. (He won't.))

[["There's something I want to say," he muttered to nobody in particular, assuming that at least some of them would probably hear him. "But the feline one should tell us who she watched and what she saw first. It probably doesn't matter, but maybe it changes something." He glanced over at where the feline one was somehow still snoozing, despite the noise that had woken everyone earlier. "Does anyone know when she's going to wake up?"
]]

 

[Namohysip]

Oh, full disclosure, in case it's unclear: whenever Diyem mentions that someone like Ntairow says something, but it was actually Sike, I'm kinda just blurring the lines for the sake of consistency.

 

[Namohysip]

We might have... different philosophies there, eheh... Whoops.

 

[Sike Saner]

@Namohysip Noted.

@Tanuki I think you forgot something:

Tanuki. Shortly before the previous day ended, I called your attempt to protect yourself into question, citing the fact that I'd asked Negrek if that was possible and was told that it is not. You didn't have a chance to answer me before the day ended, but you have a chance now.

Now, what you saw in the thread, what you saw when I questioned you, was admittedly something of a knee-jerk reaction. I've had time to think about it since, and yeah, I suppose it could have been an honest mistake. Maybe you just didn't think to ask Negrek first--in all fairness, it didn't occur to me to ask the "are we playing with overdoses" question until close to the end of day 2. Or maybe you just didn't think you had time to ask and get an answer back. Maybe you were just desperately grasping for protection without thinking.

But even so. Even given that. Even given how much your actions have baffled the actual frick out of me throughout the game. I can't help but find it extra fricking weird that you would attempt a night action during the day.

What are you playing at?

Nothing to say about that?

 

[Namohysip]

Killing Persephone makes you look impossibly innocent... and thus suspicious.

After (finally) reading up on the Wine page that qva linked to, and then reading this...

Of course, I would say that, given it's suspicion against me, but I feel like that could be said of anything anyone's saying here.

I can't help but realize that Tanuki is basically codifying the page lol.

"But the feline one should tell us who she watched and what she saw first. It probably doesn't matter, but maybe it changes something."

I agree with this, but that kind of makes me wonder if we should have the people we know have roles to disclose who they went for so we can see if the stories match up... Is that a good play? Let me know.

 

[DawningWinds]

I'm confused why qva is placing Sike and DW in the "Good" pile after what happened last night, especially after putting Espeon in the good pile shortly after. Even though there's a chance that Sike was roleblocked (and going over my notes, her behavior is consistent with this so far) Dawning Winds in particular still doesn't seem cleared to me.

I'm fine with voting me off today. As I said yesterday, if we end up mislynching I'd say I'm the mislynch that seems to be the best choice (not much of a loss + gives good info). The only reason I changed my vote to Persephone was because of her "I really don't wanna die and I really don't wanna a roleclaim" which to me sounds like "I'm a scum and don't have a fakeclaim ready yet". Before that I wasn't even slightly convinced she was Mafia.

 

[elyvorg]

I agree with this, but that kind of makes me wonder if we should have the people we know have roles to disclose who they went for so we can see if the stories match up... Is that a good play? Let me know.

I guess, in general, it would depend on who's most likely to be lying - if someone who's faking their claim spoke up about their actions last, then they'd be able to make up a lie that didn't contradict anything else.

But at this point, all we've got left to announce (since you couldn't act last night, and DawningWinds has already spoken up) is Espeon, and then our two doctors, whose targets won't affect anything else anyway - at least, as long as it wasn't Starlight Aurate.

( @Tanuki , you have still not confirmed whether or not it was Starlight Aurate you protected last night. Please at least tell us this much. If it was her you protected, it will tell us the mafia either used their strongman or roleblocked you. Obviously the mafia already know that anyway, so this gives us more information than it gives them. There is absolutely no reason for you not to speak up here. Did you protect Starlight Aurate or not?)

My main point here being I don't see any harm in having Espeon tell us now, since there's no-one else left to announce their actions anyway.

...Short of any roleclaims that might happen today, I guess. Hm.

 

[kyeugh]

[[Desper shrugged his shoulders. "You'd be s'prised how many times I been shot at by my own once the sheriff shows." A wall with his name, mug, and 2000 appeared for him t'lean up against. He flipped out his iron'n tapped it 'gainst the bounty. "Lot to be gained from turnin' in one'yer own. Makes you look clean's gold'n a vault. Small hit fer a big heist'n all."

He flipped his iron back'nto its holster 'n' gestured t'wards the Switchers Three. "Told y'it was a gambit. Killin' makes y'crazy, though." He smiled'n reached for the bottle 'e'd just conjured while his free paw pulled the brim of his hat o'er his eyes. "Wouldn't put t'much thought'nto that three business, persn'lly. Errythin's threes. Cr'ation dragons, Reshi'n'all them, 's an easy number to jump to. A'course," he pulled his brim up just enough to raise a brow t'wards Diyem. "Nuttin' more damnin' than'gnorin' evidence 'gainst ya."]]

OOC/Translation: Yeah, I know it's an insane theory, but I just think it's a possibility. That whole event made three people look very innocent. Now that it's in question, who it made look innocent should be under suspicion. Killing Persephone makes you look impossibly innocent... and thus suspicious.

As for the threes thing, yeah, it's just a common number. States of matter, monitors, stages of chu-evolution, it's just an easy number to cross someone's mind. I wouldn't put much thought behind it. Of course, I would say that, given it's suspicion against me, but I feel like that could be said of anything anyone's saying here.

i get what you're saying here, like, technically, but it's just... it's not good play. at the risk of maybe sounding a little harsh here, the entire object of mafia (if you are town) is to figure out who is innocent and who is mafia. taking someone who is by your own admission "impossibly innocent" and trying to make them look scummy is something the mafia does, or at the very least something that benefits the mafia. it gets us further from achieving our endgoal, which is sorting all players in the game.

i get that you think there's a minuscule small chance we're all horribly off track here and i understand the impulse to make sure we don't take anything for granted, but in this game, basically nothing is ever 100% confirmed, so throwing doubt on everything unless it's certain (or worse yet, outright stating that things are more suspicious the better they look) just means we never get anywhere, and that's how we lose. healthy skepticism is fine, but if you're not engaging with the evidence we have now and are instead pushing an extreme fringe case, it's no longer healthy, it just distracts from the matter at hand.

i think it's possible i only care so much about this because i'm the one implicated by it, because no one seems to really be taking this theory seriously so i'm not really afraid it'll actually come to fruition or anything, but on the other hand, i do think you're town for the time being (though your play is seriously testing my trust in your otherwise believable claim), and i would really like to see you play along with town productively—as i said, the point of the game is to sort every player, and if you consistently play against the interests of the innocent, it calls into question the things supporting the theory of your innocence, until it only makes sense to read you as scum. mislynches are bad, so if you really are innocent, it would be immensely beneficial for you and for town to play like it. if you don't, you're functionally no different from the mafia as far as day play goes.

as for the theory that i voted/asked others to vote for persephone in order to clear myself—i already looked more innocent than almost anyone in the thread, because most evidence suggests the mafia targetted me n1. axing a scummate and complicating my win condition to double down on what was already a substantial clear would be wildly unnecessary.

that's probably the last i'll say of you for a while, but i feel like i had to get it out there, because it's mildly frustrating to see these posts continuing to pop up.

 

[elyvorg]

Actually I suppose the doctor's targets might affect something after all if they targeted the same person Espeon watched, just like the whole business we had yesterday - except a contradiction there wouldn't definitively prove the doc to be lying anyway because mafia roleblocker aaaaa.

(I admit I'm not super experienced at this either and am mostly trying to figure it out as I go.)