I am not missing the discussion this time!! Good morning everyone I am the
Empath!!! Here were my results from the first night:
- N0: 0. (The number of Elgyem's 2 alive neighbors (this would be
Rui/
Hareta) who are evil)
But... THAT all just happened. Watt is confirmed innocent through Virgin...
Last night I was going ??????? because if Watt was innocent, that means that Rui was the spy, and it was a setup to kill a townie d1. Neither Rui or Hareta is evil, but Rui’s information means that it was either Hareta or Watt, so it has to be Watt. Watt gets confirmed innocent through Hareta’s information. So Rui’s information was wrong... but does it make any sense as a play? I don’t think so... it seems more likely we got confused. It didn’t seem like Rui knew what was going on for it to go badly, while if there was a Spy involved they would’ve known that Hareta was the Washerwoman and Watt was the Chef, like shouldn’t they have picked people without verifiable information instead of the two that could outclaim each other? And just out of how Rui was talking it sounds like she was very confident in the information... I think she was drunk or poisoned.
And then I got my night action results:
- N0: 1. (The number of Elgyem's 2 alive neighbors (this would be
Madeline/
Hareta) who are evil)
so yeah i ughhhh
- N0: 0. (The number of Elgyem's 2 alive neighbors (this would be
Rui/
Hareta) who are evil)
- N1: 1. (The number of Elgyem's 2 alive neighbors (this would be
Madeline/
Hareta) who are evil)
Aer outs themselves as an Empath (????????????????????????)
[[Vote Madeline @Inkedust ]
- Odette is the Virgin.
- Watt was the Chef.
- No evil players were neighbours on N1.
- Technically, Watt could also have been the Spy.
- Hareta's Virgin information was accurate. He could also be the Spy.
- Rui was Drunk, Poisoned, or lying.
- We do not have a real Investigator.
- There is a Soldier and/or there is a Monk and/or the Mafia chose not to kill on N1.
uA votes Madeline
Additionally, I need to make it clear, this is what my role PM said:
The 1st time you are nominated, if the nominator is a Townsfolk, they are executed immediately.
I’m trying not to be salty but wow it really sucks when you’re absent for just a couple hours, come back to a vote train, and then any possible explanation given is met with complete crickets. For this reason I’m side-eyeing every single person who I know was awake at the time everything unraveled/I defended myself because y’all had several hours to consider my arguments and said absolutely nothing. Real convenient that suddenly I have people defending me now when it’s too late.]]
Gonna be real, I also found this strange. Not because of the time thing, but because NOW suddenly there's merit to her arguments. I knew damn well that wild galaxybraining is not Yellow's playstyle and I cannot for the life of me understand why everyone was quick to vote her instead of assuming drunk/poisoned
"Well, I imagine the poor girl didn't expect us to trigger the Virgin's killing power while she slept. The Plusle's provenance was still the question when she was last participating, if I recall? She wouldn't want to out herself as such a critical role unless necessary. It certainly seems she was taken unawares by the events of the previous day phase and left in a state of panic towards its very end. One can hardly blame her for that."
"But all things considered, we were going after the very two players she had information on. Unless she has a damn solid defense for that, I find it hard to excuse.
Especially considering she also voted for the very person she could have cleared as innocent.
“So you go all-in. Elegym must die before they get a result.” [[Demon wakes before any town roles so although their target continues playing the game it’s an effective roleblock.]] “Four townsfolk have claimed info roles, there’s three or four left. You just have to hope none are a Monk protecting the most obvious info claim, because if that happens you’re already dead. You also have to get me to disregard my incriminating result, but I left them an out there when I softclaimed possible drunkenness. If I don’t trust my night zero results, and I’m poisoned on night one, surely I’ll conclude that I’m drunk~”
“I’ve got the Clairvoyant [Fortune-Teller] emera. I get to pick two players next to me each night and am told if I picked the Demon, but one townsfolk gets chosen to look like a fake Demon to me. Night zero, I picked my neighbours and found a demon. Night one, I did a replication experiment: Rocky, who’s not townsfolk and therefore can’t be chosen as my false positive, and Madeline again.”
[[Technically, it’s within Inke’s rights to turbo-frame Watt, making them my fake demon and also choosing them to register as a fake minion to Rui. It’d be unconventional though and I think there’s a more likely explanation.]]
“No dice. My night zero and night one results are borderline contradictory. Seems the most plausible explanation by far is that I was poisoned night one, inadvertently confirming that I’m not the drunk, and my night zero results were accurate!”
And with that, she pantomimed a curtsey to Madeline.
“Goodbye.”
@Inkedust VOTE: MADELINE
[[Gonna be deadass, where were you trying to softclaim? I didn't catch any of that, tbh. Maybe I'm just stupid--I'm notorious for missing things--but this really slipped under my radar. I also, simply put, don't follow your logic here.]]
"Rui said she was an Investigator and learned either Hareta or Watt is the Scarlet Woman. Because we know Watt was the Chef, and Hareta is either Washerwoman or Spy, her info is clearly busted. So it's still the case that either she was lying, she was poisoned, or she's the drunk. The game not ending means she's not the Demon, but it's still possible she's a minion."
"Elgyem vaguely corroborated Rui and said Hareta is innocent yesterday, but has now clarified that what she actually learned was that there are zero evil players between Rui and Hareta. This could be true info, in which case Rui was drunk or poisoned, and Hareta is definitely Washerwoman. Or Elgyem could be the Drunk, in which case Rui can't be the Drunk. Or Elgyem could have been poisoned last night, in which case, again, Rui could not have been poisoned that night. Or Elgyem could be lying, but scum lying specifically to vaguely corroborate and narrow down info they know to be false sounds very unlikely. The simplest explanation is it's true, and would've been a point of actual evidence in Rui's favor yesterday when we could've really used it, goddamn it."
[[Free outlines my frustration with Aer not coming forward with the info because yeah]]
[[Anyway, I’m going to lay out several of my reads and suspicions.
Yellow Readlist
uA readlist. Noting that they haven't claimed yet.
"He can't. Watt died when he voted for the Virgin. That's 100% confirmation for him and Odette."
Again, my role PM:
The 1st time you are nominated, if the nominator is a Townsfolk, they are executed immediately.
"We did consider the possibility of Hareta being a Spy. The thing is you said one of the two was the Scarlet Woman, not the Spy. There was zero reason to suspect him in particular of being evil other than your info, and your info was 100% wrong either way. Either you were drunk or poisoned, so there was literally no reason to distrust Hareta, or you were lying, so there was literally no reason to distrust Hareta. Obviously you could be drunk or poisoned, because anyone could be, but the point was either way there was some reason to distrust you and zero reason to distrust him. Without actually hearing from Elgyem about what her info was, anyway. In fact, I found it pretty fucking suspicious that after it was clear Hareta was obviously not the Scarlet Woman, people were still trying to push Hareta anyway and not the person whose info had actually just turned out to be bullshit. The way I saw it, could've been your buddies trying to keep up momentum on what should've been a dead train to divert attention from you, until they saw it wouldn't fly and got on board."
[[I don't think pushing Hareta was suspicious at all--it was totally and completely possible that Rui's info was incorrect because she was Drunk/Poisoned. Add that to the fact that, and I pointed this out, Hareta let info slip that they were EXPLICITLY TOLD BY 3 PEOPLE TO NOT SAY ANYTHING ABOUT (the existence of the Virgin). I would argue scum/scum-aligned players had every reason to do this because non-townie players voting the Virgin can be mechanically outed as not townie. It would VERY MUCH BE IN SCUM-ALIGNED INTEREST TO POP THE VIRGIN POWER. I'm now more certain of that after learning that they probably gunned for me last night (ofc I'm the easiest kill because I guarantee no new info). Which is why I stayed on Hareta. ]]
"The dodgier point is Elgyem did vote yesterday at the very end, and voted for Rui, despite supposedly having info to suggest she was innocent. Not impossible, maybe she was just doubting herself and her info at that point, but worth a bit of a side-eye."
[[And this!!!! Nobody is talking enough about this!!]]
Dave furrowed his brow, squinting at Morgan. "That... sounds pretty fucking convoluted to me? It relies on the mafia drawing one specific conclusion about you based on a softclaim that there was no indication anyone'd even noticed, concluding you're specifically the Empath, and that because you distrust your results you'll conclude you're drunk if poisoned this specific night, instead of just trying to kill you, and therefore your night zero results were accurate but your night one results are wrong? And this is all to conclude that your innocent result today on the person being accused actually proves they are scum, because your night zero result couldn't have been confused because... it would've meant Watt was 'turbo-framed' by appearing as a fake minion to Rui, who was either drunk or lying or poisoned? The Investigator doesn't say there's a specific player who appears as a false positive for them at all." He shook his head. "Sorry, but this sounds way fucking galaxy-brained to me."
[[AND THIS. I feel vindicated seeing that I'm not the only one here who feels Phan's play here is farfetched.]]
| Madeline/Persephone | Mechanically-Confirmed Demon | teehee |
"What do you
mean 'mechanically confirmed'? Where the hell are you getting that? I've been starting to get some smoke-blowing vibes from you and this definitely isn't helping your case."
[[Actually, the Virgin
can kill the Spy
according to the guidebook.]]
[[Per my role DM:
The 1st time you are nominated, if the nominator is a Townsfolk, they are executed immediately.
Also, correct me if I'm wrong, I know this is technically a "bastard" type game but wouldn't that be indicated in the roles?? I know people ARE looking at the wiki to help them out but that tidbit is buried in there......I'm not saying it's not true but I feel like that would have been more obvious? Idk]]
[[While I appreciate you thoroughly addressing one of my points, you’re not acknowledging any of the others, and this feels like the first time you’ve entertained the possibility I was drunk or poisoned. And the last half of your theory, of my hypothetical scum buddies jumping immediately on the vote train on me, doesn’t hold up. The train was immediate and unanimous with no push-back whatsoever. There wasn’t even an attempt made to divert attention away from me.
[[This is also true, abrupt and no arguing]]
"After the Virgin reveal, Malachai voted Hareta, Drake did some waffling where he voted you initially, then Rocky voted Hareta, then Drake also moved to Hareta instead. After that I voted for you, then even after that Odette voted for Hareta, although obviously she was doing it for innocent reasons. After that Madeline voted for you and the train for you picked up from there."
[[I voted for Hareta for reasons outlined above. There are def more suspicious players at this point in the game, but I stand by my vote]]
I am the slayer. I will get one shot today to prove my innocence before you all take my jewelry privileges away. I will need some time to gather my bearings and decide who I wish to attack.”
Perse roleclaims Slayer
I wanted to keep it ambiguous whether I was the Empath or Washerwoman or Librarian, who would be able to have the information to back up Rui. I softclaimed one of those roles by being able to corroborate Rui's information, but I didn't want it to be obvious which one I was. For example if the mafia thought I was Washerwoman (before Hareta claimed), then they wouldn't gain anything by poisoning or killing me, so I would slip under the radar and be able to have a second use of sensing my neighbors. Regardless of my plans, I wasn't going to claim on D1 because I didn't trust one day's readings enough to come forth and claim on the very first day - that almost guarantees that I'll not be able to get a second Empath check, and I had no idea if I was poisoned or drunk.
That... is a good point [[lol]]. In my defense I will say that the votes were like 7/2 for Rui at that point, so my vote wouldn't have mattered either way. My vote came out of the spy idea I was considering last night and thinking my N0 info was compromised, but since it didn't matter... It would've been better if I didn't vote at all, it sounds like?
[[Okay, I understand wanting to stay ambiguous, I can let that slide.
As for the voting thing......I don't understand the logic? What do you mean it would have been better if you didn't vote? I'm dying on the hill that being that both of the players you had info on were under scrutiny, it boggles my mind that you kinda just let it roll. I understand your reasoning for not immediately coming forward but honestly, I don't feel good about it.]]
It’s not just about your vote, it’s that you didn’t say anything when you supposedly had evidence of my innocence. Not only did you not share, you voted FOR me despite (again, supposedly) knowing otherwise. This is very sus behavior to me!
[[P much what I said above]]
Re: timezone shenanigans, I definitely don’t want to hold it against people unfairly or rely on it more than in-game evidence. However, Dave did start the vote train on me and it feels…odd to accuse me of an insanely reckless scum play when there were plenty of much more reasonable explanations very readily available. Yes, technically Hareta started the vote train, but I’m 100% certain it was a retaliatory vote more than anything.
[[I still think that vote train is insane, like why are we NOW so certain Rui is innocent after she fucking died???? Guys, come on.]]
"This morning I received a vision of the Leafeon's innocence. To my initial chagrin--her behavior before the day's end was most befitting a cornered enemy. Was my vision a product of a mind addled by poison? No, I think not. See here:"
[[Went a bit hard on flavor so I should clarify--I am the Undertaker. I was told that Rui held the Lucky Charm Emera. I was a bit leery of poison at first, but after reading Morgan's experiment I'm very convinced that I couldn't have been poisoned. Also as an added bonus, if Rui's the drunk then I can't be. I guess technically she could be evil and I could be drunk, but I thiiiink that's actually straight-up incompatible with both Morgan and Elgyem's inspections.]]
Chibi roleclaims Undertaker
It's true that I didn't. I was worrying over my wording quite a bit because if I were to say directly that Rui and Hareta were innocent, then that would ascertain that I was the Empath, which I wanted to avoid (it felt VERY obvious that I was sitting right next to Rui and Hareta, the two people I would be claiming as innocent, which would make it super obvious that I was the Empath who had information about the people next to me rather than the Washerwoman/Librarian), but obviously that's not a solid claim of Rui's innocence that I could've made. My consideration at the time was that it would be obvious that you were an investigator if Watt was guilty, but if you were a Spy, then you could have been lying about your targets while also appearing innocent to my checking, because Spy would read as innocent. ... And then since Watt was innocent, that called into question whether Rui was innocent. If Rui was telling the truth and there was nothing going on, then Watt or Hareta should have been guilty. But that didn't happen. Based on our shared information, one or both of us were compromised.
[[More Aer explanation]
It was a bit late to go pick someone else to kill based on vibes, and notably, we learned who you are and who the Demon is as a direct result of it.
[[NO WE DIDN'T???? WHY AM I THE ONLY ONE CLOCKING THIS LOL]]
Catching the demon (which I firmly believe we have done) in exchange for even a larger number of lives is a positive. Townies are already more expendable than Mafia in Mafia but BotC takes this to an even further extreme. In Mafia, Mafia only needs plurality while town need to eliminate EVERY scum player. In BotC it’s the evils who have to eliminate EVERY townie (unless people waste their ghostvotes) while town only has to get the head honcho (and potentially scarlet woman if they exist and the demon dies so early that they inherit) further incentivizing even more callous disregard for the lives of town if you just get the demon. By all measures, unless Madeline is (very implausibly) innocent, then this is truly going well. I firmly believe that we’re winning and maybe some real fuckshit is happening, scum is laughing at me, and I’ll eat crow. But I’m not spinning.
"I cannot for the life of me understand why you are so certain of your result. How the
fuck do you know you weren't compromised on your reads?"
"Rocky agree! Smart play, smart. Morgan run experiment, eliminate variables! Results make sense, especially if Madeline is Poisoner! They could catch softclaim (which Rocky admits Rocky missed, bad bad, stupid) and know to save own skin they must poison neighbor to falsify results. Bad. Tamper with science, Rocky does not like." He stamped the ground several times with rapid disapproving grunts.
[[Please tell me, what is smart about it??? I don't even understand it. It just strikes me as a galaxybrain thing that's gonna get thwarted by another play. I don't understand you all calling it a good play??? Unless I'm the stupid one????]]
This would still check out though, with night scum chat making a plan to protect Perse's identity by tampering with your results. They poison you, and take a shot at someone else, but then we have a Soldier or a very lucky/clever Monk. Definitely agree there's less chance of there being a Spy if there was no night kill; they'd know how to navigate around that by shooting at the Monk, specifically. And even though I missed your soft claim, if the scum team didn't, they could definitely zero in on tampering with your results last night to protect their Demon.
[[Well not necessarily; what if they're trying to avoid it being known there's a spy in the game? We're blowing smoke around there possibly being a Spy and consequentially wasting time and maybe panic voting; that works in their favor]]
Actually, looking at this now, are we *sure* there are no duplicate roles in this game? Kinda crazy that we can just out the Demon and end the game. Would there be multiple Demons in play? Again bonkers to think the Drunk role would be the one with Scarlet Woman, who would inherit. Is there any way the Scarlet Woman *IS* in play but we just wouldn't get a role to confirm it? There's nothing saying we NEED an Investigator IF a Scarlet Woman is in play. Both can be true: no Investigator AND Scarlet Woman exists...
[[No there would have to be a Scarlet Woman; if we vote out the Demon before a Scarlet Woman, they become the demon.]]
"Rocky suspect we do have Scarlet Woman in game... Anyone think otherwise, question?" Another double tap.
"No, I'd be decently surprised if there weren't at this point."
[[I have checked with Inke and been told that we lose if the living evils can outvote living town, ghostvotes (on both sides?) being able to change the outcome doesn’t matter and the game will be ended anyway. A little odd to me, but unlikely to matter too much? We still just have to get the demon to win. Even if some of the D1 play is a bit aggressive in that context, we got lucky to find an evil in time to offset that.]]
This is what she says:
If you are Evil, your aim is to destroy the town. When you control the majority of votes (50% or more), evil wins.
You, Phan, told me earlier that parity wasn't a thing.....................but doesn't the above mean parity? Again, smoke blowing.
[[This is as good an opportunity to get some reads down. I genuinely think that the only way that Morgan and Elgyem's inspections could have lined up the way they did in the order they did is for *both* of them to be on the same scumteam, which would be insane. If *one* of them was lying, even if the liar would have known the other was poisoned, there's no way they could have known what false info was going to be given by the storyteller. (At least, I'm assuming the storyteller just makes it up themselves, presumably in the most bastard-y way possible.)
I admit my read on Morgan is mostly soulreading, but in my defense, Morgan has consistently acted so pro-town and contributed to such a good D1 boardstate that I genuinely think she'd be trashing scum's chances of winning if she were scum. Putting all the scumteam's eggs into the basket of making herself look good??? Why would she do that? It'd be so shortsighted. If I'm wrong, I accept my clown hat forever.
As for Elgyem, I genuinely think that vote-switching to Rui would have been an insane move to make as scum. The vote train had already happened, half the players were asleep, and vote-switching served no purpose to scum. Letting the vote pass and flying under the radar makes way more sense, especially for newbie scum who'd usually be afraid of drawing attention. I'm getting hardcore panicked newbie paranoid their info was wrong vibes.]]
[[I wholeheartedly disagree--the one and only time I ever played scum I actively did whatever I could to make myself look good, even if it meant shooting down my scumteam (what existed of it anyway) and I made it all the way to the end of the game without being sussed (and probably would have had a good chance of winning if it weren't for FUCKING LOVERS).
All that to say, I can 100000% believe this is happening. And the more I read of Phan's posts, the more I believe it.
Wrt to Elgyem vote switching; don't forget Aer is new (no offense). That could have easily been a panicked "oh maybe it'll look better if I join the train" fumble.]]
Dave sighed, shaking his head. "Okay, so. Our first piece of info is this: on night zero, Elgyem says she was told she had zero evil neighbors. Her neighbors at the time were Rui and Hareta. On night one, Elgyem was told she has one evil neighbor, and now her neighbors are Hareta and Madeline. So, on the face of it, if Elgyem is telling the truth and not poisoned, and given Rui was the Drunk, point one in favor of Madeline being evil.
"Our second piece of info is Morgan's. On night zero, she says she was told one of her neighbors, Watt and Madeline, was the Demon. On night one, she says she was told neither of Rocky and Madeline was the Demon. Since we know Watt wasn't the Demon, if Morgan's night zero info was correct the Demon had to have been Madeline, so she would've had to have been poisoned on night one.
"Fair enough. That's one possible way it played out. But there are several other possibilities here, and I'm not wild about how Morgan's been going around saying Madeline's mechanically confirmed as the Demon after the neither Rocky nor Madeline being the Demon result that she got last night. The other possibilities include:
- Morgan was poisoned on night zero and Elgyem was poisoned on night one. This is obviously also possible and explains the results equally well, and Elgyem had a much stronger info softclaim yesterday than Morgan. Personally I would've bet on scum poisoning Elgyem last night over Morgan. Telling a story about how they definitely noticed Morgan's easily-missed softclaim and definitely went for her instead of the really prominent softclaim is all well and good, but it's hardly incontrovertible proof they must have done that.
- Watt was Morgan's designated false positive, and Elgyem was poisoned on night one. Morgan thinks this is unlikely because then Watt would've been 'double-framed', both the false positive for her and one of Rui's false Drunk Investigator results. But these are completely different mechanics so I don't know that it's obvious the same person wouldn't get picked for both, the way the same person probably wouldn't be picked as a designated false positive for two different roles with a designated false positive. Wouldn't it be pretty likely to be picked at random which people Rui was told about, for one?
- Elgyem was poisoned night one and Morgan is evil and trying to take charge of the game. Obviously it's fair for Morgan not to consider this one, but we should. It'd probably be unnecessarily bold play at this stage to act so certain about mechanical confirmation, and would raise more suspicion if Madeline turns out not to be the demon, so I don't see it as super likely.
[[Liking the speculation here and THANK YOU FOR POINTING OUT THAT MORGAN KEEPS SAYING MADELINE IS MECHANICALLY CONFIRMED DEMON]]
"Elgyem did come in and actively vote Rui at the end of the day, rather than just letting the vote pass and flying under the radar. That's the thing that's kinda weird."
[[I'll say it again: could have easily been a newbie scum panic fumble.]]
Theonegamei’mnotevenscumthishappenswhywhywhywhywhy…
OOF. Wait so is Morgan not the Demon? Could still be scum aligned though.
Dave, Drake, and Malachai. Of these three, two cannot be Evil together: Dave and Drake, because they sit next to each other."
Rule: two Evil players cannot be seated next to each other
Confirmed Good: Odette (Virgin), Watt (Chef*), Rui (Drunk), Rocky (that me!)
Self-proclaimed Good: Hareta (Washerwoman), Elgyem (Empath), Spectrier (Undertaker), Morgan (Fortune-Teller)
This falls apart if:
- Watt was the Spy
- any of the Self-Proclaimed players are lying
[[I'm still having a hard time believing Watt was the Spy. I know it's in the wiki but that feels like something Inke would have included right off the bat (unless it was ONLY in the role PM in which case hehehaha fuck me]]
“Fine, my logic, again, on the Morgan shot. While it is possible that one of my accusers hit a false positive and the other was poisoned, that seemed less likely than one or both being scum. I hadn’t thought of this at the time, but if I go down it would be very easy to poison the undertaker and then have Elgyem absolve Morgan the next day. I thought the odds of some sort of scummery at play in the joint accusations were higher than the demon being one of the fairly inactive players. Should I have shot at Dave or something? Maybe. Hindsight’s 20/20.
[[I thought it was a fair play, Morgan's pretty scummy to me rn]]
[[I finally get to be town and then this happens by conspiracy or terrible luck. I think this is going to be my last game and if I weren’t immediately about to die I’d probably ask for a sub. I’m tired, I don’t see a way out of this, and I’m not even sure how much help I can be in this game anymore if no one is ever going to believe I’m town.]]
[[Yeah I'm just getting straight frustration here]]
From where I'm standing, it looks almost inevitable Malachai and Drake are both scum.
"The most easily faked claims here are Spectrier's and Rocky's.
[[One of these things is not like the other bbg. Malachai and Drake are inevitable but Spectrier and Rocky's claims are easiest to fake?]]
[[I think it's interesting that Dave plants the idea that Mal is inevitably scum but does admit later in the body of the post that it could easily be Spectrier instead. That feels like a motivated frontloaded claim followed by ass-covering, to me. I'm getting a bit of a scum ping from that, I think? I'm leaning Dave over Drake for tomorrow's vote.]]
[[Yeah that]]
"Spectrier wouldn't be scum instead of you. He, or Rocky, would be the third scum instead of Madeline. I mean, I guess maybe it could be Madeline and Drake and Spectrier or some shit, but that's not what I'm looking at right now. I'm looking at you, Drake, and a third person who could be Madeline but my gut says it isn't at this point. I've yet to take a really good look at what's possible, but I doubt I'm reconsidering either of the two of you without a claim."
[[Idk man I don't think Rocky should be up in there. Butler is a wildly random thing to claim. Also, I have clocked Pano as scum every single time she's been scum; I think I'm willing to trust her for now]]
[[Yeah my whole argument for the honse hinges on being neighbours with the honse. Sind's hard-confirmed, I trust zdr enough, I'm town, I have a null read on Chibi, therefore it's probably Chibi. I haven't found any scumtells in Chibi's play or anything (especially as they'd had a hell week at their work), I just have to assume there's pretty good odds they might be mafia since you and Tetra (Flyg0n) can't both be scum and there are only so many valid suspects (if I trust who I've decided to trust). If Perse isn't mafia, then I necessarily have to start looking at Pano/Tetra (I do not believe this is a real scumteam) or someone I've decided to trust already, like aer. It's easier to believe that it's you and Chibi. Hope I'm right, sorry if I'm wrong, lol.]]
Speculation
[[No energy to put this ic right now. Some stray thoughts:
-Assuming that Rui really is drunk and assuming I wasn't poisoned n0, the only way both Dave and Drake could be mafia is if one of them is a spy. While not impossible, I lean towards the Scarlett Woman/Poisoner/Demon make up as more probable based on role claims thus far. I don't want to rule this out, but I want to focus my energy on more pertinent reads.
-Although unlikely, I don't think the alt theory I presented regarding Madeline is impossible. I remember there was some pretty insane mafia play in one of the previous games. I can't remember if it was a predicted vig-shot that was redirected via bussing or a cop/rolecop read. The point being, it's unlikely play, but not impossible. There are other leads I would follow first before revisiting this one as it currently stands.
-Whether scum or town, Persephone continues to be the unluckiest mafia player around.
-Gonna head out for now but if I have time/energy, I'll probably try to do a more in-depth read of the more sus players before eod.
Speculation
“Okay, so a general explanation of my play, I guess. The little ghost behind me is most experienced trying not be suspicious and getting someone irritating killed. Less good at deduction when she genuinely does not have information.
My strategy this game was largely stay quiet and not immediately claim. I thought my role, if it was anything like vigilante, was going to be a high priority target if I was forced to claim. I also had no good information to reveal.
When Day 2 came I was spiraling and literally a bit sick. I wasn’t really out of brain fog until later in the afternoon when I moved towards taking a shot. I didn’t have a strong scum read on anyone. The best idea I had was that at least one of my accusers was probably lying since they were wrong and a weird chain of events would have needed to happen for them not to be lying. The second accuser position feels easier to be scum since you’re mixing your “information” with a more credible source.
I also haven’t really been active since due to extreme frustration and the belief that giving my sincere thoughts would be counterproductive. After all, if scum were targeting me so hard, why wouldn’t they poison the undertaker? (Assuming Chibi is town.) If my thoughts were going to be dissected as obviously spiraling scum trying to cover for her teammates, why bother?”
Perse play
"Lastly, I should take a guess at who else I suspect. I think there's serious risks to playing the game a turn ahead of time, so I don't want to go too far..."
Morgan looked between the oddly-large Noivern and the dog. Both of them were accusing each other, one of them was almost surely right and the other lying. Then, she shot a look at the Noivern, trying to lock eyes.
"But I'm just going to soulread Noivern for a moment: I've decided to trust him for now. I have my reasons. I'm curious to see if he acts how I expect him to, though. That's all."
Historically, both Jackie and Tetra are usually way more aggressive town players. They’re often vocally in favor of voting someone out at random on D1. They are rarely absent from EoD shenanigans, especially when an unexpected twists happens, and are actively part of the scrambling to resolve things in the chaos. I saw none of that here, and while the EoD likely chalks up to time zone differences, I’ve noticed very little scumhunting overall from either of them, like Pano said. This pings me as very very odd.
So, for now, I’m speculating a potential scum team of Drake, Malachai, and (very very tentatively) Morgan. Main reason for placing mild sus on Morgan is the aggressive assertion of Persephone’s guilt and the fact that Morgan has been rather fiercely defensive of Malachai specifically right out the gate.
[[Mmmmmmmmm in my experience Tetra usually only gets aggressive when she's backed into a corner. Jackie.....idk, I feel like they've been more passive this game even if they are posting a lot, so I can see that argument]]
More observations: I’m starting to lean towards very soft town on Free for now, but she’s always a tricky one to read, haha. Tetra’s absence this phase has me side-eyeing a bit—I know she was busy yesterday but there’s been complete radio silence today as well…would very much like more input from you!
@ everyone else, I’m going to be busy the rest of the night and probably the rest of the day phase. At this point, I think it might be best to abstain rather than vote out Persephone. It’s probably too late in the day phase to pressure anyone else (how convenient for scum!) so I’d rather we play it safe. Just something to consider!]]
[[Nah, we should vote for Morgan or Drake]]
"For the love of fuck. Yes, I'm the fucking monk, and I protected Odette, because of your helpful fucking analysis about how it's actually often better for scum to kill ironclad confirmed innocents and poison inforoles instead. Fucking--
To be clear, my vote is still on Madeline at the moment, because my evidence is still circumstantial and Madeline is still a player with two redchecks on her and I'm not actually sure who else would be the third scumteam member (I've begun to entertain the thought that maybe there isn't a third scumteam member?) and I'd feel like the world's biggest clown if I singlehandedly persuaded everyone to back off a player with two separate redchecks and then it turned out she was the actual Demon after all. But. All cards on the table, the mafia almost certainly targeted Odette with the nightkill last night, which means if they really did poison Morgan last night, that means they chose to ignore Elgyem, and that sounds a bit funny to me. (In fact, if that's what happened, it sounds like Elgyem might be scum?) If Morgan wasn't poisoned last night, then her result means Madeline is not the Demon. But she could still be a minion.)]]
Odette nodded as she wagged her finger at Dave. "Yeah. That tracks all the way. I had a very strong feeling that I was a solid scum target because killing me ensures the least information possible. Ignoring Elgyem though....that is an interesting play. Maybe they didn't see them as a threat yet, somehow? They didn't admit to the rest of their info until toDay."
[[Eh fuck it I really don't want a Maddie bus to win as my #1 priority. And I should give more consideration to evil Drake if I trust Dave now anyway, which I had not adequately considered. This will read as wishy-washy. Sucks to be me, I'm just gonna have to live with that reality. I still don't trust Spectrier.]]
@Inkedust VOTE: DRAKE
I'm the mayor. I've been desperately trying to signal this without giving it away to scum because the first think on the wiki tells me I need to survive until the end of the game. But also not to have them try and kill me? I've been trying to hint at alternate winco a a other ways to win and it's why I've been so waffley, I feel like we can really still win this with the info we have.
[[Okaaaaaaayyyyyyy interesting, we have a mayor reveal]]
"Your role would be no big loss. The mayor requires absolute trust to activate, which you were never likely to have, and is only helpful when which of the other two players is the Demon is unclear, usually because they both look evil and one's probably a minion pretending to be their demon... Which, in this particular ruleset, is just a premature game over instead. A poisoner could easily have neutralized your kill resistance if they were scared of it, but I for one would not likely have even bothered, were I scum."
[[????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? HANG ON A SECOND BRO???
You've spent this entire phase insisting Madeline was mechanically claimed, insisting some galaxybrained softclaim shit you've been up to that I absolutely did not catch, and just generally giving me an extremely smoke-blowy vibe, and your first response to a presumable town claim (granted, I will offer, from a player currently being sussed) is to be say "nah no loss, vote"??? I'm sorry, based on what I've read of your posts up until now, I my towny read on you has flipped a lot. You might not be the demon, but I do think you're scum aligned. You're blowing too much smoke and making a lot of suspiciously certain claims that you cannot back. ]]
Vote Morgan/Shiny Pantump @Inkedust
[[I don't have it in me to make a readlist right now, I am hanging on by a thread but I owe it to the townies to get this up. Will not be around for eod and will be more active in the next phase. Thanks for understanding y'all]]
"Oh! She couldn't find a way to call Odette a virgin furry in her own monologue, but I'm quite happy to do it~~~"
Odette raised a fluffy brow. Ear twitched. Foot tapped. Then she laughed. Hard.
"Furry? Sure. In this state. Virgin? Absolutely not. I'm very unfortunately yet mostly proudly male anatomy-oriented and have the polycule to prove it."
